# $LogEntry = $IPAddr . ", " . $WhoFrom . ", " . $txtDate . ", " . $MyAddr . ", " . $SayWhat . ", " . $millisec . "\n";
10.229.1.57,David F.,Fri 12 Dec 2003,fankhadb@uc.edu,Look on my page on Beginning Cheesemaking under the discussion of milk. The short answer is that one can make cheese with most any store bought milk.,1071259666686
64.85.15.247,Glenn L.,Thu 01 Jan 2004,galange@plix.com,Your Cheese Page has inspired me to try making cheese myself (today‚ in fact). I am thinking that commercial cheeses still contain useable cultures‚ I.E. swiss cheese‚ jarlsberg‚etc. Am I correct or crazy?,1072969899230
68.170.101.16,David F.,Thu 01 Jan 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,GLENN:
I do not recommend that anyone new to cheesemaking attempt Swiss cheese. (See my page on Beginning Cheesemaking.) Swiss cheese is quite complex‚ requiring an additional specific bacterial culture not used in other cheeses (Propionibacter shermanii) plus a complex series of temps‚ humidities and salt baths‚ taking up to a year to complete. To answer your question‚ it is plausible that live cells of this bacterium survive in mature Swiss cheese. However‚ to attempt this cheese the first time‚ I would purchase the culture from New England Cheesemaking (see my links).,1073000636171
68.170.101.16,David F.,Thu 01 Jan 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,MAKING SWISS CHEESE:
Dean‚ you motivated me to post the Swiss cheese recipe I have had for a while. It is at Making Swiss Cheese. You will see that it is a challenge...,1073004926265
64.85.15.243,Glenn L.,Thu 01 Jan 2004,galange@plix.com,OK no swiss yet‚ but I did get a lively culture from a small amount of Jarlsberg today...perhaps cheddar or gruyere. They can't kill the culture without ruining the cheese is my theory.,1073008991130
155.91.6.71,Ann,Fri 02 Jan 2004,ann_hutchinson@merck.com,I love your page and I believe it has given me the courage to try making cheese. But I have a question...when you say "milk" as in your yogurt or basic cheese receipe‚ do you mean fresh‚ unprocessed COW's milk? Your other recipes (like feta) say "goat's milk." I will have goat's milk‚ so does that mean I can't use your recipes that just say "milk"? Obviously‚ I'm new to this...your thoughts would be appreciated! - Ann,1073077900711
68.170.101.16,David F.,Sat 03 Jan 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,ANN:
While there will be differences in a given cheese based on which milk source is used‚ to my knowledge‚ the recipes I have posted will work with any untainted milk. I use goat milk because that is what I have‚ but have used store-bought cow's milk with success. I know from experience that store milk works fine for yogurt and many cheeses. However‚ reconstituted powdered milk may not be satisfactory‚ in my experience.,1073153742092
68.226.107.216,thomas bricker,Mon 05 Jan 2004,tjbricker2002@yahoo.com,i have made a blue cheese and a farmhouse chedder and am ageing them both in the same cooler. now the farmhouse chedder is getting a blue mold on outside and was wondering if it is taking on the blue mold and flavor. you can age them together cant you with out hurting them ,1073354379125
68.170.101.16,David F.,Thu 08 Jan 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,THOMAS:
Whether you "hurt" the cheddar by aging it in the same container as blue is a matter of taste‚ but you will certainly get Penicillium growing on the cheddar‚ and get a bit of the blue 'tang' in its flavor. If you want to preserve the cheddar nature of your cheese‚ it should be aged separately from the blue.,1073613623530
205.188.208.168,Bobbi Harris,Wed 21 Jan 2004,Blkschndog@aol.com,David‚ you should really write a book on Cheese Making for Dummies! This place is great! I had made cheeses with my aunt years ago when she had a small dairy goat herd‚ we now have our own small farm and yes that includes our dairy girls! I now make goats milk soaps and cheese. Your recipes break things down so nice‚ that I can't wait to get my kids into the cheese making! Even tho they don't eat much of it! Mom does!!! Thank you so much!!!!,1074689837478
67.60.4.244,Anvah,Sat 24 Jan 2004,anvah@yahoo.com,Dear David‚How do you maintain proper humidity and temperature at home? I'm making my first Mozzarella from your page. I'd like to try Cheddar eventually. But the aging has me worried since I have no room to maintain the proper temperature or humidity. (Fridge is the closest I can think of. )Thanks‚Anvah,1074999634568
10.229.1.57,David F.,Mon 26 Jan 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,ANVAH:
We live in a 150 year old house with a stone (unheated) basement. I can age cheese quite nicely there in the winter (about 45-50 F) If I need higher humidity‚ I age in an unpluged refrigerator in the basement. In the summer‚ I use a refrigerator with the thermostat turned as high as it will go. I adjust the humidity with a pan of water of the diameter which yields desired humidity.,1075135198930
66.125.215.160,W. D. Bathgate,Tue 03 Feb 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,I'd like to know if Lemon juice can be substituted for tartaric acid in making cheese.If so‚ what is the conversion?,1075849009484
68.170.101.16,David F.,Fri 06 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,W.D.
I rarely make cheese with exogenous acid (I prefer acidification by fermentation)‚ but I am certain that you can substitute lemon juice for tartaric acid. There are vinegar cheeses too‚ but these don't seem appetizing to me. Calculating the conversion factor for tartaric acid to lemon juice is a good challenge for a student of chemistry... anyone?,1076124417890
202.56.198.158,moazam azam,Sun 08 Feb 2004,moazamazam@yahoo.co.uk,After searching for a week and viewing different sites i found your site most intertesting and easy to follow.However i havent yet started actually making cheese.The Measures and weights are given in Gallons and pounds which are rarely used in India.If litres and KGs is used it is easy to follow,1076178905770
68.170.101.16,David F.,Sat 07 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Moazam:
I strongly endorse the use of metric system for measuring. I try to include both English and Metric on my pages. At home I would like to metric (esp. temperature)‚ but often use Tbl‚ tsp‚ cups‚ etc... Please let me know which pages do not include metric measurements.,1076186708890
202.56.198.158,moazam,Sun 08 Feb 2004,moazamazam@yahoo.co.uk,how do i get the colour of kraft cheese (yellow),1076250338460
205.200.33.59,Diana,Mon 09 Feb 2004,terrdia@hotmail.com,Thank you!! Do you know how difficult is‚ first of all‚ to find cheesemaking instructions at all? If there are some‚ they often assume we know more than we really do. Your instructions are wonderful! I was especially impressed with the fact that you actually tell what rennet is‚ and WHERE IT CAN BE FOUND. WOW! That wes my biggest question. Maybe I'm unusually dim-witted‚ but I don't think so. I'm getting fresh farm milk this morning‚ and now at least I know where to get rennet. Wish me luck.,1076337142180
67.113.198.33,W. D. Bathgate,Mon 09 Feb 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,Thanks David. My next question is two fold. First‚ How much liquid rennet to tablet rennet?And second‚ What happens when you use too much or too little rennet?,1076376454390
67.113.198.33,W. D. Bathgate,Tue 10 Feb 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,OK‚I found the rennet liquid to tablet equivalent on your pages. Thanks much. I still need to know what happens when you use too much/little. Also I can't find citric acid powder anywhere but the net and I don't like ordering. Can ascorbic acid be used to make mozzarella?,1076427828578
66.125.213.249,W. D. Bathgate,Fri 13 Feb 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,Ok‚ I have another one.Does using cream of tartar have the same affect as tartaric acid?They do differ somewhat in composition.Thanks‚Wes,1076717762296
66.125.213.249,W. D. Bathgate,Fri 13 Feb 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,By the way‚ sorry for so many questions I've become VERY inspired.,1076717762296
68.170.101.16,David F.,Fri 13 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,BATHGATE:
You answered your own question re. liquid rennet equivalence vs tablet (1 tsp = 1 tablet).
Re. chemical acid use in cheese making: I already mentioned I prefer bacterial acidification. If you want to use chemicals‚ purchase pH paper and add sufficient acid powder to reach the desired pH. Tartaric acid (a crust formed during wine fermentation is used in air bags and cosmetics) is more acidic than cream of tartar. (I.e. use more "cream" than "acid."),1076723231609
66.125.213.249,W. D. Bathgate,Sat 14 Feb 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,THANK YOU! :>) After only two tries I got a clean break and made my first cheese with your 1-gallon recipe!And on the third try I actually made CHEESE!:>).I was able to find a Beer makers supply store that had Tartaric acid and made some of the best tasting Mascarpone Ive ever had.I cant get it in my local store either which made it a REAL treat.Anyway‚ thanks again. Youve really made may year.Wes,1076780135500
24.215.147.80,Jonathan,Sun 15 Feb 2004,jo@yetidesign.com,i notice you use frozen buttermilk in one of your recipes...does freezing kill the milk's culture? is frozen buttermilk interchangeable with fresh? ie can you still make buttermilk pancakes with thawed buttermilk...with the same effect? love your cheeses!,1076873748839
68.170.101.16,David F.,Sun 15 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,JONATHAN:
Yes‚ frozen buttermilk is interchangable with fresh buttermilk if it is kept fozen solid (0 F or below) and tightly sealed. The bacteria are relatively unaffected by the freezing (but they do not like repeated freeze/thaw cycles). And yes‚ it would work perfectly in pancakes. However‚ I only freeze it so that the culture remains pure over several months.,1076898390281
65.27.94.141,Eric,Wed 18 Feb 2004,no@email.please,What is the proper way to store yeast and for how long can it be stored? I have some leftover yeast for my breadmachine that I put in the freezer but its been sitting in there for about a year so its probably not good anymore‚ right?,1077130598560
68.170.100.197,David F.,Wed 18 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Eric:
Freezing yeast is good for storing for long periods (maybe even a year)‚ but several cycles of freezing/thawing is a killer. You should perform the classic test: 1 Tbl yeast‚ 1 tsp sugar‚ 1/4 cup warm water. Mix thoroughly. If it doesn't foam up in 15 minutes‚ it will do a poor job of raising bread.,1077154558203
195.229.241.167,Steve Sykes,Fri 20 Feb 2004,ssykes@eim.ae,I am quite impressed with your cheese pages. Do you have a recipe for Icelandic Skyr?,1077255130437
65.58.128.125,Rose,Sat 21 Feb 2004,solarranch@ispwest.com,Thank you Thank you Thank you! As a true homesteader wanna be‚ I am seeking all info related to dairy and cheesemaking. I needed some true basic information. I will try this prior to my moving south to the ranch after retirement.,1077398051652
68.122.10.86,Ingrid,Sat 21 Feb 2004,goesnar@msn.com,Dear Dr.Fankhauser‚I just love your website‚ it gave me a lot of information on the chemistry of cheesemaking.I currently residing in Indonesia‚ went to school in United States before and also a cheese lover.In Indonesia‚ it is so expensive to purchase cheese and fresh mozzarella is just not available.Now I will test on making the cheese.I am wondering if the humidity (temperature) and the type of milk will affect my cheese making process?Thank you‚Ingrid,1077407220796
68.170.100.197,David F.,Sun 22 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,STEVE:
Officially‚ skyr needs a special starter from previously made skyr‚ but an approximation is:
1) Scald 1 gal skim milk‚ cool to 100 F.
2) Stir in 2 tsp cultured buttermilk (should be skyr for starter).
3) Dissolve 1 rennet tablet in 1/4 cup cool water‚ stir into milk.
4) Let sit at 80 F for 4-5 hours until soft clean break.
5) Cut curd‚ drain in cloth like labneh.
Here is a web site for skyr. Or cut and paste: http://www.isholf.is/gullis/jo/Miscellaneous.htm#thet,1077479533125
68.170.100.197,David F.,Sun 22 Feb 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,INGRID:
Temp and humidity especially affect the curing of cheese. Yes‚ the type of milk affects the taste and consistency of cheese. For instance‚ the best mozzarella is made from water buffalo milk. (Do you have that available in Indonesia?) But a cheese can be made from any milk. Go to my page on Beginning Cheese Making for suggestions for first projects. Moz is a bit of a challenge.,1077479533125
67.31.178.113,Sandy,Tue 24 Feb 2004,kkshoe@mfire.com,Your directions are wonderful! Thanks so much for the detailed information. I have a housefull of children..all were excited and even the non readers could check if I was doing it right. Thanks again,1077677357250
194.165.156.65,mazin marji,Sat 06 Mar 2004,mazin_marji@hotmail.com,I like your web site and I would like to ask a question: is it OK to make white cheese by mixing milk from cow‚sheep and goat and what is the best way to do that? Thanks,1078606827842
68.170.101.8,David F.,Sun 07 Mar 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,MAZIM:
I am sure there should be little problem mixing a variety of fresh high quality milks‚ though the precise times for a clean break‚ and the quality of the firmness of the curd will vary. Pay close attention at each stage (see my page on basic cheese)‚ and make the slight modifications necessary. Please keep us informed about your findings.,1078686196328
67.70.82.128,al,Sun 14 Mar 2004,al@yahoo.com,thank you,1079313021639
62.2.239.2,U.Curjel,Wed 17 Mar 2004,ucurjel@hotmail.com,Great site! This week I'll try making yoghurt. I have access to farm fresh (cooled) cows milk. Is it necessary to pastureize it or can I use it "raw"?,1079548403128
68.170.102.48,David F.,Thu 18 Mar 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,U. CURJEL:
Because one scalds and cools milk before making yogurt‚ the scalding is actually MORE than pasteurizing it. So‚ no need to pasteurize. Use the fresh milk (even better‚ use it immediatelty while still warm). Pay attention to proper cooling to below 55 C before adding the starter.,1079624847874
64.161.226.183,W. D. Bathgate,Sun 21 Mar 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,DAVID:I did make some good mascarpone but it never really developed any "tang" to it before it started to smell like bad milk. How do I get the aged flavor out of it?,1079925564968
68.170.101.160,David F.,Wed 24 Mar 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,W.D.:
Mascarpone‚ according to the recipe I use‚ is acidified with tartaric acid‚ not bacterial fermentation. Thus‚ it will not get any more tart than it is immediately upon preparation. "Aging" it will only encourage contaminating bacteria to grow‚ and can cause off flavors.
Two solutions: 1) use a little more tartaric acid than the recipe currently calls for‚ or 2) try inoculating the cream with 1/8th part buttermilk just before you add the tartaric acid. The buttermilk will cause continued fermentation with "good" bacteria.,1080139365703
66.50.2.137,Carlos Bauza,Sat 27 Mar 2004,bauzace50@yahoo.com,Looking for buttermilk in the internet‚ your site came up! Thanks! Is it possible to purchase cultured bacteria for making buttermilk? I cannot get any sort of buttermilk in Puerto Rico.Please help.,1080425113093
68.170.100.128,David F.,Sat 27 Mar 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,CARLOS:
Check out New England Cheese Making Supply (http://www.cheesemaking.com/) for the precise cultures for buttermilk if you do not have fresh cultured buttermilk available.,1080427567421
64.9.86.158,Kathy Fick,Thu 01 Apr 2004,katnjack@yahoo.com,I try to make a different type of cheese each year. I found your page this year and I'm going to try 2 or 3 this year. Thank you.,1080829428610
64.161.225.14,W. D. Bathgate,Fri 02 Apr 2004,wdbath@pacbell.net,Thanks very much. I'm trying the buttermilk approach as we speak. SO‚ I gather that acidic cheeses are a "now" sort of thing where bacteria cheeses are the ones that age and become hard? I appriciate your help‚Wes,1080968771000
24.124.3.1,Teenager,Mon 05 Apr 2004,Neuralize@hotmail.com,Haha‚ these site is awesome‚ for some reason I'm compelled to make cheese. Even though I'm onl 17 and I should be typing up a paper >.>,1081182164371
69.161.219.83,David F.,Tue 06 Apr 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,TEENAGER:
I loved your comment! Thanks. I know exactly where you are coming from. Never are new projects more interesting than when you have a deadline task weighing on you. Please don't leave us hanging! What cheese will you make? I suggest either labneh from yogurt‚ or neufchatel. Did you see the page on Beginning Cheesemaking linked to my main page?,1081298092234
65.50.24.63,Mark Bulger,Wed 14 Apr 2004,markbulger@rogers.com,Thank you‚ for this wonderful website. I am a big believer in making it at home and have always had a strange love of all things fermented. I feel we are losing our touch with making the simple things in life and taking the time to learn and make cheese or beer or anything else‚ gives us a connection to life that is so important. Thanks so much.,1081989962870
67.172.176.17,chris larson,Sun 18 Apr 2004,c.larson02@comcast.net,tried to make your american moozzarella and when I got to the microwave portion it really failed it would not come together tried mic for longer worse? can you help? thank you chris,1082307628540
10.230.100.27,David F.,Wed 21 Apr 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,CHRIS:
Measure quantities very carefully. The times in the microwave vary according to the wattage of your microwave. Try pouring 1/2 gallon 80 C (175 F) water over a pound of curds to see if it spins better than using the microwave technique. (Don't know what "for longer worse" means.),1082562385354
80.200.215.172,Laurent,Wed 28 Apr 2004,laurent.cazalet@easynet.be,Hi guys‚
this line just to thank you. I find your site amazing‚ being an amateur cheese maker myself (using a french book)‚ I found lots of additional explanations and new techniques to experiment.
Congratulations for this fantastic work.Hope you'll keep the site alive long enough to give me a chance to try everything.
Cheers
Laurent,1083153120152
24.225.12.177,Joyce in KS,Thu 29 Apr 2004,adze17@gbta.net,Hi David! Just wanted to let you know that I'm still out here making lots of cheese & yogurt in Kansas‚ but with 4 children to homeschool now‚ I just haven't had much time to talk about it!! Glad to see the site is still here and going strong!,1083300691156
24.225.12.177,Joyce in KS,Thu 29 Apr 2004,adze17@gbta.net,to Chris Larson---It is possible that there is a little too much citric acid in the mozzarella cheese that you were making. Different amounts seem to be needed in different parts of our goats' lactation‚ and I have to adjust during the milking season. What kind of milk are you using? Even if it doesn't come out really smooth and melty‚ the cheese is still useful in cooking--like in lasagna. Also‚ this mozz. can be frozen and used later. I've got a 4 1/2 gallon batch finishing up on the stove right now‚ but I have "failures" occasionally even after 4 or 5 years of making it.,1083300691156
69.161.217.147,David F.,Sun 02 May 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,LAURENT:
Thanks to the support of the University of Cincinnati‚ this site has been up since before 1999‚ and‚ depending on their continued support‚ will be up for the foreseeable future. (Ah‚ the fragility of the web world. It worries me.) Let us know how your cheese projects go‚ and how we can improve this site. The French are master cheese makers--what is your connection with the French?,1083512166171
69.161.217.147,David F.,Sun 02 May 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,JOYCE IN KS!!!:
Old friend--Thanks for the feedback on your recipe for American Mozzarella (you are famous!). Yes‚ the stage of lactation makes a big difference in the process and it the quality of the cheese. I attribute the "failures" I have had in recent years to rich milk shortly after freshening.
I still occasionally see references to old Lactobacillus Board contributers Dominic and Ric.,1083512166171
63.80.99.3,Ginger,Mon 17 May 2004,Bontemps6@sbcglobal.net,Love your site‚ thanks for all the work and info. WHERE DO YOU FIND THE TIME!? I have goats; since finding your site I have been anxiously waiting for milk production to exceed demand (we drink ALOT of milk!)...I anticipate my first cheesemaking attempt in the next few days. Wish me luck‚ and keep up the good work!,1084774718470
64.222.83.216,Kris,Wed 02 Jun 2004,ksalber@msn.com,I love your website! I have a couple of questions‚ though... what size handkerchief do you use‚ and what do I do if I can't find a handkerchief? Unfortunately‚ they are not as widely sold as they used to be.Also‚ one cheesemaking tutorial said NOT to use Junket brand rennet‚ that it's "not the same thing as cheesemaking rennet"‚ not that it matters since I can't seem to find it anyway.I tried Labneh‚ but it didn't drain off the whey hardly at all‚ it was just as liquidy as when I started‚ even though it had long since stopped dripping. used walmart 'ladies' handkerchief & yogurt.,1086181057839
10.230.100.27,David F.,Thu 03 Jun 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,KRIS:
Can't imagine that plain white handkerchiefs aren't in your local variety store‚ but any fine weave cotten cloth will serve as a milk filter. Some folks turn their noses up at Junket tablets‚ but they are the same as rennet. In fact‚ the tablets have a longer shelf life than liquid rennet. (Do NOT use flavored Junket pudding with rennet‚ obviously.)
How long did you let your yogurt drip? I hope you used homemade yogurt; artificially thickened commercial yogurt may not separate as well.,1086297987508
64.222.108.161,Kris,Fri 04 Jun 2004,ksalber@msn.com,I let it drip overnight‚ but I was using commercial yogurt..the cheap generic brand since I can't afford to use regular bottled milk (too expensive and my boys go through 3 gals/wk!) to make yogurt. I happened to have some plain yogurt in my fridge and thought I'd give it a shot‚ but it barely did anything. Next time I get a chance‚ I'll try making some homemade yogurt first‚ then make labneh. I've also got to do some running around to try to find rennet...,1086357478600
200.79.67.88,DON,Wed 16 Jun 2004,YNMX@HOTMAIL.COM,GREAT INFO...JUST ONE QUESTION FOR NOW....CANNOT FIND RENNET LOCALLY‚ IS THERE SOMETHING ELSE I COULD USE?,1087437633330
69.161.219.153,David F.,Fri 18 Jun 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,DON:
In the US‚ most large supermarkets have Junket Rennet tablets in the pudding section. There are many beer and wine supply stores which also sell cheese making supplies. Or ask the managers at either of these stores to order it. There are numerous web-based supplies as well. Finally‚ herbs like Lady's Bedstraw or Stinging Nettles are reputed to have rennet activity. Will let you know after I do the experiment...,1087565624515
139.133.7.38,Ada,Fri 25 Jun 2004,ada_ma2001@hotmail.com,Hello. I learnt how to make yoghurt and buttermilk using the information on your webpages. So lots of thanks to you for putting them up. I have a question - what make greek yoghurt greek? Are there any special tricks that one must know if one is to make greek yoghurt? I am very curious. Please share your thoughts.,1088165935620
69.161.218.37,David F.,26 Jun 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,ADA:
Thanks for the interesting question. According to the info on http://www.ochef.com/257.htm‚ "Greek yogurt" is made with ewe's milk‚ which is about 5% butterfat. So two important differences:
type of milk (hard to adjust for this one since ewe's milk is qualitatively different from cow's) and
% B.F. ("whole" milk in the States is 3.5%‚ so you would have to add cream to bring it up to 5% B.F.),1088270597140
198.26.122.13,Bill Outlaw,30 Jun 2004,outlawfarm@earthlink.net,This is one of the best web pages I've ever come across!!,1088611743887
24.196.82.93,Fred in Wisconsin,30 Jun 2004,none@wisc.edu,Thank you for maintaining this page! I've referred to it many times now. The directions are remarkably clear and complete. I do appreciate it!,1088620404937
66.171.223.127,kwaku brown,02 Jul 2004,kwaku004664@Yahoo.com,why is american cheese orange‚ yet bwe call it yellow. Moreover‚ what is it that makes it orange. The "Gerat American Dupe".,1088819241731
69.161.219.125,David F.,03 Jul 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,KWAKU:
Ah‚ yes... Sounds like you suspect the answer (Great American Dupe...). Americans especially add bright orange annatto dye (http://www-ang.kfunigraz.ac.at/katzer/engl/generic_frame.html?Bixa_ore.html) to make commercial cheese "yellow." Puzzling over this‚ I suspect the origin is that long-aged cheese becomes creamy yellow‚ so the yellow suggests more flavorful cheese??? Anyone else have an idea?,1088864869312
69.161.219.125,David F.,03 Jul 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,NOTE: The link in the previous post must have a "squigle" after the / and in front of the katzer to work... Apparently my server doesn't recognize and display it in this context. Sorry. DBF,1088865511234
67.64.148.22,David E. Samara‚ M.D.,05 Jul 2004,davidsamara@sbcglobal.net,I have referred to your site many times! I make yogurt and labneh a lot since I am Lebanese. I am lactose intolerant and always have lactose-free milk at home. My question is whether or not the yogurt starter bacteria will be "happy" in a low lactose environment. I currently use regular 2% cow's milk and a very good starter from YOGOURMET (when I have no fresh yogurt.) Also‚ You and your readers with a scientific bent may be interested in "On Food and Cooking" by Harold McGee which addresses the chemical properties of food during cooking‚ baking and processing.,1089051721421
69.161.219.125,David F.,06 Jul 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,David E.:
You raise an interesting question to which you may have at least a partial answer. The bacteria in yogurt convert lactose to lactic acid by fermentation. If one used a low lactose milk as the starting material‚ I would expect the acidity of the product to be lower. Have you made yogurt with milk you know is low in lactose?But‚ as you know‚ 2% refers to the milk's butterfat content‚ while the lactose remains the same. I predict that "acidophilus" milk would not work well for yogurt. Anyone try it? Thnx for the McGee reference.,1089150990468
207.218.200.60,Barb,09 Jul 2004,bmfindley@ev1.net,I learned "how to" with this site and it is still the one I come back too.,1089391384370
207.218.200.60,Barb,09 Jul 2004,bmfindley@ev1.net,I made a batch of yogurt (2 gallons in pint jars) and incubated in two ice chests. The ice chests are identical and I have used them both for making jogurt. One batch turned out perfect; the other turned out with the consistancy of milk. The water I filled the chests with came from the same source and the temperature (120 degrees approx) was within about 3 degrees of each other. The only thing I can figure out is that the second batch got jostled too much.Question: Can I take the 'bad' batch and run it through the whole process again or do I need to throw it away?Thanks‚Barb,1089392210780
69.161.217.246,David F.,10 Jul 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,BARB:
Interesting experiment you have performed‚ the only problem is we don't know the variable! I suspect (as you mention) that the temperature difference was the culprit. It sounds like you estimated rather than measured the temp? Precise temps are very important for yogurt. Jostling would cause it not to firm up‚ but it should still be thickened like buttermilk. I doubt you can start over on the liquid batch. I would add rennet to the liquid portion and make cheese from it.,1089469589875
206.65.72.53,Liz Lirette,18 Jul 2004,lizlink@usa.com,Your web site is great.Attempt #5. 1gal milk(powder)1 qt cream‚ 1/2 cup bulgarian buttermilk‚ 1/2 rennet tab. warmed the milk to 80 added culture‚ 3hrs later the rennet. This set in laundry overnight. I made a yogurt but it was very stringy or drippy. I could not even strain it. Could it be the bulgarian style? #6 1gal. milk‚ cream I used the Mesophilic starter and 1/8 cal.chloride. After several hrs. I added 1/2 rennet to set for 18 hrs. My clean break cut the curds but then the whey got milky. I have another bag cheese draining as I write. Thanks for all the help and courage you've given thr,1090178005462
216.106.102.17,Helene & Gary,25 Jul 2004,gary@superaje.com,you have brought us back to our roots in prairie saskatchewan...we have finally found junket in ontario (nicastro's in ottawa) if anyone local is looking)...am making feta first time...am about to add the junket...whooohoooo...cheers from perth‚ ontario,1090782651616
216.106.102.17,Helene & Gary,29 Jul 2004,gary@superaje.com,...thank you !!! the feta is wonderful...we are surprised with both quantity and esp. quality......we could not have done this without your remarkable website...again‚thank you !!!,1091159822990
69.161.222.77,David F.,31 Jul 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,HELENE & GARY:
Thanks so much for feedback from our friends from the North! Did you use store bought or farm fresh milk for your cheese? I too love the pure flavor of the home made feta. As you say‚ "Whooohooo!",1091283364406
69.161.222.77,David F.,31 Jul 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,LIZ:
The recipes your are using are not from my pages? Two points right away:
1) I have not had much success making cheese with powdered milk‚ and do not recommend it.
2) Stringy yogurt is contaminated with unwanted bacteria. For successful Yogurt‚ use a fresh starter‚ I recommend Dannon Plain. See Beginning Cheesemaking to refine necessary skills for successful cheesemaking.,1091283651406
204.102.9.17,Glenn,04 Aug 2004,glenn.moeller@owp.csus.edu,Does the prohibition against using aluminum for acidifying milk also apply to anodized aluminum such as calphalon? Thanks.,1091656331610
216.106.102.17,Helene & Gary,04 Aug 2004,gary@superaje.com,our apologies to Glenn and Liz for jumping back in...we used store bought cow's milk for our feta...i don't believe this is forum for ranting about local dairy regulations...we can only imagine how good this would be with fresh goat's milk !!!,1091665563167
69.161.218.25,David F.,08 Aug 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,GLENN:
My problem with aluminum is that acid dissolves the metal‚ and the metal ions become soluble and dissolve in the milk‚ perhaps increasing the risk of Alzheimer's (and possibly other problems?) I don't think anodized makes any difference. Teflon coated would provide a barrier‚ but you don't want to overheat it (which wouldn't be a problem if you are only heating milk in the pot).,1091990003171
67.173.213.136,Micky,08 Aug 2004,mrs_micky@hotmail.com,I love your website! I have made jogurt before. My problem is the stainless steel pot which invariably scorches in a ring at the bottom. May I ask the brand name of your expensive but super efficient milk boiling pot? Thank you so much.,1091999743086
69.161.218.165,David F.,10 Aug 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,MICKY:
Any stainless steel pot with an added thick bottom (usually 1/8 - 1/4 inch pad of aluminum‚ but copper is even better) will do. The pad of metal distributes the heat preventing the hot spots you are having problems with. The one I currently use is made by "Morgan Ware" and specifies that it is 18/10 stainless‚ and carries the words "Sandwich Bottom" on its bottom.,1092148824734
63.163.194.200,barrett,11 Aug 2004,barrett@toomanychefs.com,What a great site! I'm going to annoy my wife for month's with these recipes.One other really easy cheese to put on for beginners (and the only one I've ever made) is the Indian paneer‚ found in sag paneer and other dishes. A decent recipe for it is here - http://1stholistic.com/Recipes/recipe_panir.htm,1092259606307
202.191.104.213,Aris Bakas,14 Aug 2004,aris@bakas.com.au,Do you have any suggestions on how to dry ricotta?thanks,1092469920156
216.106.102.17,Helene & Gary,17 Aug 2004,gary@superaje.com,Ooops Cheese Cake:Use Feta Cheese Recipe:1. Wait until curds have almost drained.2. Sample April's wine.3. Trip‚ catch bottle and dump curds back into whey.4. Strain again.Note: Cheese should not resemble anything close to Feta...It should have consistency of a cream cheese.5. Use cheese instead in any basic cheese cake recipe.Cake was wonderful‚ covered in Strawberry preserves. We have actually named it Fankhauser Cheese Cake....would love to know what happened...is this 'double straining' a known technique ?,1092799747826
168.8.164.246,cordarral,20 Aug 2004,cordarral16@yahoo.com,This is a very good page to learn about the makeing of cheese from.,1093018241740
4.156.102.240,Lore,23 Aug 2004,chowderpatch@prodigy.net,This page is great because it has good pictures and good instructions. I have a question‚ though. My curds fall to the bottom of the pan. Am I doing something wrong?,1093267464360
195.128.38.180,Polat Karlidag,24 Aug 2004,industry@sarkuysan.com,Dear Sir‚I thank you it's realy great.I will try to do home cheese if I can do that I will make my cheese factory after that I will invite you to see it.,1093355405110
69.161.221.15,David F.,28 Aug 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,ARIS:
How dry do you want your ricotta? Two suggestions 1) Let it hang an extra day or two in the fridge‚ 2) freeze it and thaw it (forces out water). If you want it DRY‚ I have no experience‚ but you will have to salt it and press it.,1093709521655
69.161.221.15,David F.,28 Aug 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,CORDARRAL:
Thank you for your comment. Let us know which cheese you make! May we ask where you live?,1093709521655
69.161.221.15,David F.,28 Aug 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,LORE:
The curd is SUPPOSED to sink after you cut the curd. If it floats‚ that means it is contaminated with CO2-producing bacteria. Sounds like you are succeeding.,1093709521655
69.161.221.15,David F.,28 Aug 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,POLAT:
I recommend you start your cheese making journey with the cheese projects on my Beginning Cheese Making page. I hope to be able to visit your cheese factory some day! Where do you live?,1093709521655
209.143.46.49,ken roark,02 Sep 2004,kroark@horizonview.net,hello 1st of all thanks for the great page on making cheese........but i need some help! i used raw whole milk to make NEUFCHATEL for the first time.........i left the cream in‚ instead of skimming it off.....after adding the rennett i let sit undisturbed for 12 hours (overnight)‚ the next morning it seemed to be set but i was unsure.........so i let it set for another 12 hours... then i did the clean break test again and i noticed that under the surface approx 1/2" it was set very firm‚ but the top was not.........i proceeded to cut and ladle out when i noticed that what was on top was t,1094125143157
216.86.72.65,Jenny,02 Sep 2004,sagehill@provide.net,question about innoculating milk... on your "Critical factors in getting a clean break" page‚ you state that inoculated milk should sit undisturbed overnight; yet most of your recipes say to let it sit 1-2 hours.when should it sit longer? Thanks‚ ,1094178477109
69.161.217.171,David F.,09 Sep 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,JENNY:
The "DO NOT DISTURB" sign is up only after the rennet is added. It does not matter while the inoculum is "ripening" them milk. Some recipes add rennet with the inoculum. These should not be disturbed from the beginning. Others let the inoculum work for hours before adding rennet. No problem aggitating these prior to adding rennet.,1094738096921
69.75.83.26,grant grider,19 Sep 2004,gnc@bak.rr.com,enjoy your site.Have been brewing for years‚just started making cheese.Am looking for info on "longhorn cheese"Any info you have would help.Again‚great site.,1095614298734
62.180.53.220,Gareth,20 Sep 2004,Castaway_Robinson@yahoo.co.uk,Thanks for the great informative website. Just a short question. I made Stilton a couple of days ago‚ it is now drying‚ but I am not sure about the exterior texture. It seems to not be very bound together (as it is not really pressed much). It his correct (or should I have pressed it harder)? THanks,1095671190369
64.222.106.195,Kristin,20 Sep 2004,xphish@msn.com,For those looking for Junket Rennet Tablets‚ it is avaiable online (and in person) through the Vermont Country Store: http://www.vermontcountrystore.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=6152&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=39&iSubCat=173&iProductID=6152 In the store‚ one box is under $3‚ but online you can buy 3 boxes for $8. This has been one of the only places I have found it.,1095702421768
64.136.26.228,Michael Newsome,25 Sep 2004,newsomething@hotmail.com,Do you have any recipes / instructions on making burrata cheese?,1096147696265
198.234.102.127,kim lewis,30 Sep 2004,klewis@mail.gsn.k12.oh.us,We are going to make the ginger ale and root beer but I was curious if anyone knows the amounts to use if you are using splenda and sugar for diabetic students.,1096551487718
69.161.218.101,David F.,30 Sep 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Gareth:
In my experience‚ the reason cheese does not bind together when pressed is two fold:
a) the curd was too cold when placed in the press‚ and
b) there was not enough pressure in the press.,1096558370015
69.161.218.101,David F.,30 Sep 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Grant and Michael:
I do not have recipes for either longhorn nor burrata (tell me more about the latter). If anyone DOES have recipes for these‚ please post!,1096558370015
69.161.218.101,David F.,30 Sep 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Kim:
In order to have carbonation in home made rootbeer or ginger ale‚ you must add sugar. Pasteur discovered this connection. So‚ no‚ you cannot make carbonated drinks using fermentation with splenda or other artificial sweeteners.,1096558370015
64.223.81.18,Kristin,01 Oct 2004,ksalber@msn.com,Question: I have a bottle of Cola syrup (kept around for cases of nausea). Can I make carbonated cola with that the same way as the root beer?,1096650928043
69.161.218.101,David F.,02 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Kristin:
Presuming that cola syrup is THE major flavor in cola drinks‚ then you certainly could use it just like root beer extract in my recipe for making home made root beer. Let us know how it turns out! Where did you get cola syrup?,1096724794705
64.223.81.18,Kristin,02 Oct 2004,ksalber@msn.com,I bought it at the Vermont Country store. Their online store is just as good as their in-person store. Lots of old-time remedies.www.vermontcountrystore.com It's difficult to find cola syrup anymore (as I found out when I was pregnant 3 yrs ago)‚ and when you do find it it's usually in a tiny bottle. Vermont store has it in a nice big‚ like 10 oz bottle‚ I think. Costs $10 at most.,1096726217640
64.223.118.4,Kristin‚ Again,04 Oct 2004,ksalber@msn.com,I made basic hard cheese (it is ripening in the fridge now). After adding the rennet and letting it sit for 3 hours (I think?)‚ the milk separated‚ but the curd sank to the bottom in one large lump. I couldn't tell wether I had gotten a clean break or not‚ so I went and cut the curd. I ended up with the tiniest curds‚ almost as if the curd had shredded rather than been cut. What did I do wrong? Took me much longer to drain and press‚ but it's finished...unsure how it turned out though‚ taste wise.What happened?,1096919404229
62.180.53.220,Gareth,05 Oct 2004,castaway_robinson@yahoo.co.uk,Kristen‚ It sounds to me like you let it sit for to long before you cut the curds. Obviously it depends what cheese you are making but I always leave it at 90F for about 90 minutes (but you can ckeck it before this). You should not have to leave it more than 5 or 10 minute more than this before you cut the curd. I suspect that your cheese will now come out very dry. What were you making? Hope this helps.,1096978045840
69.161.218.101,David F.,05 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Kristin (and Gareth):
I agree with Gareth. You probably should have cut the curd earlier (as soon as you get a clean break). But this is not serious. Sinking curd is good (floating curd has bubbles which could be bad). It sounds like you cut the curd too small: should be 1/2 inch cubes. I believe your cheese will be fine‚ if hard and dry (as Gareth mentioned).,1097021657184
80.180.161.151,lejahnke@lycos.com,06 Oct 2004,lejahnke@lycos.com,Dear David f. I found your site yesterday and read so much that I had a nightmare about you last night. You and cheese. I am in Italy at the moment and preparing to return to the States. I am not sure I can live without tomini and fresh mozzarella. I found the recipe for fresh mozzarella but do you know how to make tomini? If the answer is on your site‚ I am sorry I did not find it yet. For the moment‚ a short answer will do until I return. Should I try to bring back a chunk of tomini or is that irrelevant? I guess another question is should I bring back gorgonzola? ciao//lori,1097040629780
64.222.108.58,Kristin,06 Oct 2004,ksalber@msn.com,When I cut the curd‚ I cut it into 1/2 inch cubes as your tutorial described (I had it printed out and stuck to the range-hood above the stove). When I cut it‚ though‚ it fell apart...not liquidy‚ but fell apart. I can't remember how long I let it sit...my parents came over right then and I was interrupted for awhile.,1097064393549
69.161.219.63,David F.,09 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Lori:
Gorgonzola: If you are premitted to bring in gorgonzola‚ that would be an excellent choice because in the States it is of lower quality and higher cost. I am not sure whether USDA will permit it‚ but because of its long cure time‚ it should be OK.
Tomini: As I recall‚ these are like tiny flavored mozzarella balls? I do not have a specific recipe how to make them. I KNOW they are fresh cheeses‚ and doubt that USDA will let them into the country.,1097337530421
193.158.186.81,Gareth,10 Oct 2004,Castaway_Robinson@yahoo.co.uk,David‚ I hope you did not mind me jumping in there a couple of days ago with the response to Kristin! Now for my question. Friday was the GRAND OPENING DAY (1 month maturing) for my first cheddar. A little crumbly‚ and needs more time for the favour to develop more fully‚ but not bad. My question though‚ is when I tried to melt some cheese‚ it did‚ it just kind of browned on the surface. The favour and the texture seems to be OK‚ so any ideas why this should happen ? I am using whole cows milk‚ and 50 Pounds of pressure in the mold. The cheese was air dried for 4 days then waxed,1097443575445
193.158.186.81,Gareth,10 Oct 2004,Castaway_Robinson@yahoo.co.uk,Sorry‚ that should read...it did NOT melt.,1097444171762
219.88.24.79,Vanessa,11 Oct 2004,vanessa1nz@yahoo.co.nz,Hi There! This is a great site! Well done :) I have been successfully making yogurt for a few months now without a thermometer‚ in the hotwater cupboard... But I will definitely get a thrmometer now so I can try making some of your cheeses. One I make at the moment: You heat raw cows milk until it starts to rise‚ then add lemon juice‚ stir and strain thru cheesecloth. Rinse in water‚ then press (I use a good sized rock) for a few mins‚ then eat! Even the kids love it‚ esp with a little rock salt and olive oil to dip it in. What do you think? Is this real cheese? Cheers from NZ,1097482768970
12.218.73.162,Liz,13 Oct 2004,;izlink@usa.com,Yea. I have finally succeeded in making a clean break. I kept some of the whey to drink which is quite good. What is the calorie‚ protein‚ and other nutritional info. Please guide me. Thanks. L,1097705780320
10.230.100.27,David F.,15 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Gareth:
Cheese that is more acid will melt more. Two ways for this to happen. The most effective is to let the curds sit several hours in a warm place (some recipes call for leaving it in the whey) to acidify before pressing. The other is curing. Acidification will continue in a cheese that is aging. I believe your cheese will melt better after it is several months old. Also‚ my experience is that goat cheese does not melt as well as cow's.,1097856687641
10.230.100.27,David F.,15 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Vanessa:
Cheese is essentially the protein separated out of milk and either eaten fresh or preserved. So yes‚ what you describe is a simple cheese. It will be very mild‚ and will not age well (lacking bacterial starter which helps acidify the cheese).,1097856687641
10.230.100.27,David F.,15 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Liz:
I have added a line on my page on the nutritional content of milks to include whey. Also on that page‚ I have placed a link to the USDA Composition of Foods data base that you can use to search what ever food product you are intersted in.,1097856687641
24.159.179.58,Steve Chastain,15 Oct 2004,src@utk.edu,I've read several pages calling for Chymosin as part of making cheese. Please tell me where I could purchase this or if I really need it.Thank you very much for your website..I have been wanting to learn to make cheese for years and your page has given me the confidence to give it a try.Thank You‚Steve R Chastain,1097890334978
69.161.217.204,David F.,17 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Steve:
Chymosin is another name for rennet‚ the enzyme which coagulates milk. Yes‚ you need rennet (chymosin) for most cheeses. I have used Junket Rennet tablets successfully for years‚ and get them in the pudding section of my local supermarket. Look at my web page "Beginning Cheese Making" for suggestions for first cheese projects.,1098024024265
169.229.123.27,Tim,23 Oct 2004,tim@cleves.net,There is an interesting article in todays NY Times(http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/23/nyregion/23mozzarella.html though I don't know how long you can read the archive)about how the state health inspectors are stopping all the small Italian cheese stores and dairys from making the traditional mozzarella! Apparently nowadays cheese made this way can be bad for you! What a pity. Thanks for creating a site that will allow me to try making my own cheese (until the inspectors close us all down).,1098570170407
69.161.219.33,David F.,24 Oct 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,Tim:
Thanks for the post. (One has to be registered with NYTimes to see the article.) The article points up the legal US prejudice which favors corporate interests and slams the small family producer. Most artisan cheese producers have struggled to satisfy obsessive/compuslive regs which want us to trust only corporate foods. Rather than clean up and humanize corporate meat and dairy production‚ they want us to overcook meat and eggs‚ and give up the unique delicious home made cheeses etc. Cost to gormet taste in the US? Just taste cheeses and real salamis in Europe.,1098628651046
208.61.158.154,Domenic Abitino,28 Oct 2004,domenic@abitino.com,I want to thank you for the extensive info you provide on your website.i am from napoli Italy (now reside in central Florida)and my da as been making fresh mozzarella for the last 40 years and that was the only cheese I was tought. through the years I have developed a passion form this milky substaince. I am dyeing to try you recipe for bluecheese. I will let you know the results. I must tell you I have tried to make ricotta and let me tell you I got it down and tasting really good. Wish you could try it. Well once again thank you for all yur Info. Domenic Abitino,1099022308437
208.61.158.154,Domenic Abitino,28 Oct 2004,domenic@abitino.com,PS I am a chef and owner of an Italian restaurant here in Melbourne Florida.www.abitino.com,1099022308437
216.228.163.40,Dianne Crampton,30 Oct 2004,tigers@uci.net,What a wonderful site for the beginner. I have been looking for a cow farmer's cheese through our local stores for over a year and committed to make my own. It is essential to my family's cheese cake recipe. You filled the ticket. Thank you!Dianne Crampton,1099153885906
68.18.14.205,Domenic,31 Oct 2004,domenic@abitino.com,I am having a hard time getting goat's milk to coalugate. Any suggestions?I keep ending up with this gelified yogurt substaince.,1099200624453
198.81.26.13,Margarita,04 Nov 2004,Margaritasart@aol.com,I just want to thank you for all the information on making cheese. I made my first cheese with store bought milk. It worked just great! I have always wanted to know how to make cheese‚ and your sight gave me all the basics that I needed to do just this.I am on my third one pound cheese made from store bought milk!( Never knew I could use store bought). All three seem to have a different taste to them ‚ I love it! I started with homade yogurt as my starter. The result‚ a cheese that I had tasted in Mexico‚ sharp with a taist of beer!‚ at least- that is what my son and I thougt. Love it‚ love it,1099590001720
61.11.93.30,Loren Claassen,05 Nov 2004,loren@myrealbox.com,I live in India and am tryinig to have a friend bring out the equipment to make cheese. What do I need to order to make Cheddar in particular? Loren,1099652525020
69.161.221.121,David F.,06 Nov 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,DOMENIC:
Thanks for your posts. I would LOVE to see your dad's recipe for mozzarella if you would share it (email me). For failure to get a clean break‚ see my page on troubleshooting.,1099754203031
69.161.221.121,David F.,06 Nov 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,MARGARITA:
Congrats on your successful cheese making! The art of cheese making often results in variations with each cheese that one makes‚ especially at the beginning. Tastes like beer??? Hmmm. That would be a big draw for some folks ;-)
One of the variations could be your homemade yogurt. You might try Dannon plain‚ or fresh cultured buttermilk as a starter to see how the taste is affected. But the bottom line is‚ if you like the results‚ stick with the technique!,1099754203031
69.161.221.121,David F.,06 Nov 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,LOREN:
The more problematic ingredients for most far-flung cheesemakers are rennet and bacterial starter. These can be purchased by mail (see links on my main page.) Plain yogurt or cultured buttermilk are often available for starter. Pots and thermometers are usually available. Look at my page on Beginning Cheese Making for detailed suggestions.,1099754203031
68.102.217.155,loring,11 Nov 2004,loringejahnke@lycos.com,your cheese site is fabulous and your videos are even bettter. i just returned from several years in italy and am astonished at the paltry selection of cheese even in the heartland of america: Cheddar. Swiss. Colby. i rang the supposed cheese expert at the university and asked if i could audit a lab or two to watch how cheese is made. she said no. I had already found your page but then I found your videos. Thank you‚ thank you‚ thank you. I don't need her. If you get around to it‚ tape yourself making fresh mozzarella. ciao//,1100140401549
68.102.217.155,loring,11 Nov 2004,loringejahnke@lycos.com,someone inquired about making yogurt with UHT milk. I never made cheese but i made yogurt for years. On Guam‚ I would cut the tab off a UHT container‚ insert a teaspoon of Dannon plain yogurt as a starter & leave the box in the oven overnight. The pilot light was sufficient. In Italy‚ I did the same thing and left the box on the radiator in my hotel. The technique worked fine in both places. I am not sure that yogurt isn't so easy to make that you almost cannot fail. Life should be like yogurt. //ciao,1100140401549
62.180.53.220,Gareth,12 Nov 2004,castaway_robinson@yahoo.co.uk,David‚ Are you aware of any health risks from the bacteria of making Blue Cheese (such as breathing them in‚during pregancy‚ etc)? Thanks. Gareth ,1100260601871
69.161.222.10,David F.,14 Nov 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,LORING:
Sterilized milk (UHT) can‚ with care‚ be used for making yogurt without scalding. Pasteurized milk cannot. UHT is rare in the States. Careful control of incubation temperature favors success.
GARETH:
Tho theoretically plausible‚ I have never heard of health problems from blue cheese mold. It may make infinitesmal amounts of penicillin which MIGHT be of allergic concern. Some might be allergic to the spores.,1100442074718
155.97.234.11,Bryan,16 Nov 2004,bjl8@utah.edu,Terrific site‚ Dr. Fankhauser. I won't let the rennet snobs get me down! I have only made small forays into cheesemaking‚ based on recipes in the Rennet box. After reading through the posts‚I'm excited to move on‚ but I'm still vague on one thing. How exactly does one modify the "Basic Hard Cheese" recipe to make Cheddar? You defined "cheddaring"‚ but I'm still a little dense on the topic. Also‚ is bandaging strictly necessary? Thanks‚ BJL,1100663017872
69.161.216.16,David F.,20 Nov 2004,fankhadb@uc.edu,BRYAN:
Cheddar cheese is made by "cheddaring": mats of fresh curd are cut into slabs which are turned regularly as a means of accelerating acidification/curing of the curd before it is pressed. This turning of slabs originated in Cheddar‚ England.
Bandaging of fresh cheese helps to wick whey which comes to the surface after it has been rubbed with salt. It also keeps dirt off the surface. ,1100961795875
213.237.55.236,Peter,23 Nov 2004,cheese@naeslund.dk,you can see a picture of the actual cheddaring process here: http://www.naeslund.dk/peter/files/cheese/cheddar.jpg -After cutting the slabs of cheese‚ as shown on the picture you need to knead a good pile of salt into the cheese before pressing it long and hard.. ( typically 24 hours ) before putting the cheese in vacuum baggies or other airthight containers,1101249852627
216.51.142.9,ellen,07 Dec 2004,jsmith@rconnect.com,this is an awesome site,1102442005790
161.184.19.102,Gloria,07 Dec 2004,albertaoxen@telus.net,I liked the recipe for making a buttermilk culture from scratch‚ that I could make from ingredients that I had on hand‚ and the recipes to use that culture to make cottage cheese and sour cream. Is there an easy way‚ like that‚ to make cream cheese? Also‚ I wonder why the butter that I make from fresh raw milk stays harder at room temperature than store bought butter? ,1102460891022
24.45.33.178,Agnes,18 Dec 2004,agnesholzberg@optonline.net,Your website is great! But‚ I am having trouble making Mesophilic starter from purchased enzymes. I have been following instructions in Ricki Carroll's book and I am not sure that what I have created is correct. My starter is solid and yogurt like‚ but there is a lot of water like fluid in Mason Jar. Do I just pour off the fluid and use the thick yogurt like substance? Thank you for your help. I am trying to make cheese for a school science fair.,1103380705500
70.57.42.221,Tracy,18 Dec 2004,paris1889@msn.com,What a fantastic website - I refer to it often... I live in Denver - are there considerations for altitude that need to be made? I cannot get the batch to the curd phase - I suspect it's the starter. I've tried both buttermilk and yogurt. I've tried both following the recipe to the letter‚ as well as have changed variables trying for a different outcome‚ and basically I get the same outcome each time - no clean break. I've also reviewed "how to achieve a clean break" without success so far. Any words of wisdom?Thank You.,1103392712531
207.69.137.204,lynn,19 Dec 2004,creole717@peoplepc.com,I cannot get my goat milk to "set" It is canned‚ all i can get now‚ and i have tried several different things.Please help!!,1103461222845
66.165.52.50,Ricky Knue,19 Dec 2004,tknue@valleyint.com,I am very excited to get started. I can't find rennet locally‚ so will have to order in. I am presently teaching a biotechnology class in high school‚ to expose students to all aspects of 'life technology'‚ especially the ancient ways‚ and for our last lab we will attempt some sort of cheese making in the portable I teach out of. We have successfully extracted DNA‚ conducted an oil bioremediation lab‚ studied moldy tofu‚ planned for phytoremediation‚ studied the effectiveness of fungi and remediation‚ and tissue culture. This could be the best ever! ,1103465431970
213.237.55.236,Peter,20 Dec 2004,cheese@naeslund.dk,A "group response":
Agnes: The water-like fluid on top of your starterculture is whey... just leave it as is.. It wont do any harm..
Tracy: The rennet should work‚ even if the starter is bad... Test the rennet directly on a cup of fresh buttermilk.. You need to disperse the rennet evenly in the milk and wait till it sets..,1103505961926
202.63.61.77,Rachael Blomeley,24 Dec 2004,Rachael.Blomeley@sjog.org.au,I was doing a search one day on microbiology for interests sake (as you do) and came across your page. I found that your page mixed my two great loves - microbiology and cooking - in a simple‚ user friendly way. In the past couple of weeks I've made about 20L of ginger beer and it's been perfect everytime. No explosions! After Christmas I'm going to have a go at cheesemaking too. Needless to say your page is bookmarked and I'm looking forward to continuing to get all the micro-organisms I can to do my kitchen work from now on.,1103853943617
69.161.223.136,David F.,04 Jan 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,PETER: Your responses are right on‚ thanks for sharing your insights! For those who don't know‚ Peter has considerable expertise in the ins and outs of cheese making.
RACHAEL: Isn't microbiology interesting and relevant!? Thanks for your sunny report about ginger ale!,1104890422953
66.130.118.173,Ben,07 Jan 2005,Benoit.Nadeau@videotron.ca,Very nice site....very complete. I'd like to make CheddarCheese Curd (that squeaks!) but can't find a recipe anywhere!!!! Any help would be appreciated! Thanks.,1105084316498
67.169.133.140,Erica King,08 Jan 2005,eking396@hotmail.com,I am interested in making creams and cheeses‚ but I am stumped due to the neccessity to at some point use unprocessed dairy. I am extremely lactose intolerant and I want to start at the begining in creating dairy that I can tolerate. I will have to start with milk that has been treated with the enzyme that breaks down the latose.So can you help me to make cheese. I think I can use your site to make cream.Please let me know if you can help me.Thank you,1105244649703
69.162.112.70,David F.,09 Jan 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,ERICA: I have heard from folks who wanted to use lactose-free milk to make cheese using my recipes‚ and my impression is that it should work. You may want to try making lactose-free yogurt first‚ then try cheese with regular milk first to work out the kinks in making cheese... Let us know how it works for you.,1105308847015
69.162.112.70,David F.,09 Jan 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,BEN: The easiest way to make "cheese curds" is to follow the basic cheese recipe‚ but not press the curds into a wheel. To increase the squeekiness‚ my impression is that you "cook" the curds at a higher temperature than regular curds‚ say 115 F. Here is a site with a recipe: http://muextension.missouri.edu/explore/agguides/agchem/g09550.htm,1105309933343
209.102.171.48,Sylvia,10 Jan 2005,pompeii@grics.net,LOVE THE SITE! On 7/3/2004‚ Dr. Fankhauser wrote that long-aged cheese becomes a creamy yellow‚ so yellow cheese=flavorful cheese. What I had heard was that in the nineteenth century when cheese began to be produced in larger quantities‚ the cheesemongers realized that the good dairy cows‚ Jerseys and Guernseys‚ gave milk that had a higher % of butterfat‚ which made it yellower than milk from other breeds. So‚ they colored the milk from inferior breeds to make it look like better milk (higher fat content). An easy‚ historically accurate way to do this is to add carrot juice. ,1105416137140
68.192.147.126,Tina Pender,12 Jan 2005,CPender624@aol.com,i need to find out what microbes play in the part of food! this dosen't help me!!!!!!!!!,1105563692859
213.237.55.236,peter,16 Jan 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Erica: Using lactose free milk to make cheese may give you problems with the starter culture..
Sure you can make cheese with just rennet and milk‚ but the lactic acid wont be there to help develop the proper taste ( the cheese will start rotting instead of ripening )
One way to fix this problem could be to lower the pH in milk chemically with Glucono Delta Lactone ( E575 )..Mix it with warm water @ 35C ( 1 part GDL to 3 parts water ) and add it to the milk until you reach the desired pH.If you have trouble obtaining GDL you could try substituting it with Citric acid
The pH to ,1105875169679
213.237.55.236,peter,16 Jan 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Hmm.. This thing doesnt like long messages.. The rest should be here:
The pH to aim for in typical semi hard yellow cheeses is around 5.25..Cheddar and Gouda types should be slightly lower
The procedure is simple:Heat the milk to the innoculation temperature in the recipe‚ add acid till the pH is right ( add it slowly and make sure you disperse it evenly ).. Add rennet and follow the recipe as usual
And no‚ I am not making this up.. A lot of the industrially made Feta and Mozzarella products are made this way as it saves time and hassles )
If you have any questions feel free to em,1105875169679
213.237.55.236,peter,16 Jan 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,If you have any questions feel free to email me directly
good luck
/Peter,1105875169679
62.90.139.62,Margaret,17 Jan 2005,mji_kkkiwi@hotmail.co.il,Nice how you modified the labaneh page. A suggestion of mine is to add 1 or 2 dessert spoons of olive oil to the Drained labaneh. You can fold it in with a flat spatula (redundancy). Gives a lovely texture and takes some of the surprise and bite out of it esp. with goat and sheep milks.Also I use the whey in my breads ( hand and Bread-machine ) Messes up the kashrut of course but packs in the protein.,1105965843185
67.166.146.174,Josh,18 Jan 2005,pizza.guy@att.net,Excellent‚ this page is great‚ informative and beautifully photograped.I am a restuarant manager and I am experimenting with many foods. Thank you so much‚ I appreciate your work.,1106105100859
150.203.227.206,facundo,19 Jan 2005,sepulve2@yahoo.com,made your cheese two times‚ once harder (higher temp)‚ once softer (about 37celsius). The third time I got sloppy and there was no clean break.,1106106845525
209.226.118.37,Inge,19 Jan 2005,egni80@hotmail.com,I love this page. Last year I attended a cheese making course but you'r never done learning and this page makes it easy!,1106161150360
216.106.21.7,Matt,20 Jan 2005,mbowman@academicmedicine.com,I've made several of your cheeses and enjoyed them. I notice you use PVC for a mold. I was thinking of using small nested plastic buckets for mold/follower‚ but I've heard people say to avoid PVC and anything not food-grade plastic. Do you know anything about this? Is there some kind of danger of poisoning?,1106234685966
213.237.55.236,peter,20 Jan 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Matt:
PVC can contain and release some chemicals that are a suspected cause of cancer..
Professional cheese molds are made from either stainless steel or nylon‚ but I doubt it would cause you any problems using a pair of buckets as a mold / follower.
Just remember to drill lots of small ( 0.8mm ) holes in the mold to allow the whey to drain
There are 2 general processes for pressing cheese.. One way is doing the initial pressing with the curds covered with whey.. This will produce round‚ evenly distributed holes..,1106256407528
213.237.55.236,peter,20 Jan 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,The other way is scooping the curds into the mold and dry pressing it.. This will give you the same kind of hole structure as a gorgonzola / blue cheese‚ without the blue streaks tho..good luck,1106256407528
216.106.21.7,Matt,20 Jan 2005,mbowman@academicmedicine.com,Thanks‚ Peter. I'll give it a shot. In the past‚ I've used only molds with no drain holes but open bottoms. (coffee can with both ends taken out). Should I drill holes in the sides and bottom or just the sides?,1106257367089
213.237.55.236,peter,21 Jan 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Matt: The open bottom should work fine. The molds we use at work ( I work for a large dairy company in scandinavia ) are made from nylon and have holes both in the bottom and on the sides‚ but you could start with holes in the bottom and drill holes in the sides if you cant get the whey to drain fast enough.,1106300782596
216.106.21.18,Matt,21 Jan 2005,mbowman@academicmedicine.com,Thanks again‚ Peter! As a beginner‚ it's great to have experienced folks to answer our questions. I hope I can do the same for someone else one day.,1106316743971
150.203.227.207,facundo,25 Jan 2005,sepulve2@yahoo.com,If I choose to add the yoghurt and rennet at the same time‚ what should be the temperature of the milk? thanks.,1106648269960
64.222.126.82,Kristin,25 Jan 2005,ksalber@msn.com,Quick question... I read online of a way to make buttermilk by leaving milk in a clean jar on the counter until it thickens. Does this work?,1106656715391
10.230.100.27,David F.,31 Jan 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Facundo: The temp for adding starter and rennet in the same time frame varies with the cheese. Neufchatel: 65 F‚ Feta: 85 F‚ fresh mozarella (pasta filata): 95 F. There are recipes for all of these cheeses linked to my Cheese Page. Keep careful records of what you do so that you can repeat it again!
Kristin: Look at the bottom of my page on buttermilk for a "from scratch" recipe. You need raw milk for it to work.,1107210050040
69.166.70.116,Luiz,01 Feb 2005,Benson107@hotmail.com,Sir congratulations for your excelent web page. One of the best ,1107294679639
172.153.200.114,John Oechsnerf,07 Feb 2005,jo034@fac.aii.edu,Hi‚ In the recipe for the fresh mozzarella‚ it calls for 1/4th...buttermilk. I was wondering‚ 1/4th cup? Let me know please. I really like your website.Thanks,1107815455820
217.13.224.232,Rolf,08 Feb 2005,famliljeblad@telia.com,found the website so inspiring that I am going to try this out.. cheese is yummy!!Just curious how close to my favourite Port Salute i can get‚ or a havarti?,1107874408987
69.161.220.4,David F.,16 Feb 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,John O: Ops--the fresh mozzarella recipe SHOULD read 1/4 cup of buttermilk. Thanks for pointing out the dropped units...,1108609487000
151.196.112.143,Peter Cane,19 Feb 2005,Pcane@verizon.net,Dr. Fankhauser: Thanks for your website! I have a rather easy question I think. I've had a few courses in microbiology so I assumed it might not be too hard to culture some strains from some French cheeses that I like and use them for starters? Have you had any luck at this? I realize it I could get a contaminate strain on the first try‚ but I figure a few different cultures across different batches of the same type of cheese might reveal the right strain?What do you think?Thanks againPeter,1108863559681
213.237.55.236,peter,23 Feb 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Peter: If you want to grow your own startercultures it shoudnt be a huge problem if you have the proper equipment:
The common trick is growing the cultures in sterilized ( 90C for 20 minutes ) skimmed milk‚ however.. Practical experience in an industrial setup shows that you get better results by making a "dense" skimmed milk by adding approx. 100 grams of skimmed milk powder per litre of fresh skimmed milk ( or use 200g powder + 0.8 litres of water )..
On a side note: Some‚ if not all‚ french cheeses are made with unpasteurised milk that contains a load of "forei,1109139911114
213.237.55.236,peter,23 Feb 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, "foreign" bacteria‚ some of these can be pathogens‚ others may contribute to the variations in taste..
With regards to finding the proper strain of bacteria ( buttermilk-type starters typically contains 4 or 5 strains of bacteria ) it is mostly a matter of growing them at their optimum temperatures
David: I dont know if you already have some info on the bacteria used in the various startercultures‚ if not I would be happy to provide you with something "web-ready".. Email me if you are interested..,1109139911114
141.151.172.81,Tim Wagner,23 Feb 2005,tgwags@hotmail.com,Hi very interesting and informative page. I have a scource of fresh cow milk and I will very soon be tyring to make some cheese. My favorite cheese to date is Muenster‚ but I cannot find any recipees on it. Do you have any. Thanks again for an excellent website. Tim,1109192331700
128.200.251.179,Andrew,02 Mar 2005,abehesni@uci.edu,Thank you for getting me addicted to cheeze making. I got this link off a beer brewing forum (www.homebrew.com). Fantastic site‚ hats off to you. Thank you for the info.,1109811384453
68.7.204.128,Ashton Edwin-Kent,18 Mar 2005,miedvijonik@hotmail.com,This site is wonderful! I've taken an interest in different cheeses. First types from my mom's country in India‚ and now from my fiance's country in Russia. Can you please describe how and what is needed to make swiss cheese?,1111213737765
69.161.222.30,David F.,22 Mar 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Ashton: Did you see my Swiss Cheese page? You need to purchase a special bacterium‚ Propionibacterium shermanii which produces CO2 (the holes) and propionic acid (the bite) of swiss cheese. Please look a my beginning cheese page first. Swiss is a more challenging cheese than basic cheese. Walk before you run...,1111501673656
80.178.35.117,oz gadot,29 Mar 2005,info@ozgadot.com,thank you so much for this site.this is so good that you share this uniqe information.,1112133032857
200.47.172.141,Patricia Pardo,28 Mar 2005,patipardo@web-catalogs.com,Hi! First of all‚ I would like to thank you because I've learnt a lot in your web page.I do have a comment. I tried the method you describe for preparing yoghurt‚ and it didn't work. I change the warm water in the cooler for a thick wool blanket and to my delight the recipe worked! Next day the yoghurt was still warm. I think it is much easier to control the temperature with the blanket.Best regards‚Patricia,1112045847571
205.175.225.22,Tom,04 Apr 2005,kickin_it_up_a_notch@yahoo.com,Fantastic web page. I have made your Fresh Italian Mozzarella 5 times now.My first time was an utter disaster. I used homogenized whole cow's milk from the store‚ and never got a clean break. I thought I remembered reading somewhere that homogenized milk may interfere with a getting a clean break.Since then I have used 1 gallon of skim cow's milk from the store mixed with 1 cup heavy cream.The second time I tried it‚ I got something that appeared like large cottage cheese. The curd was firm on the outside and soft and creamy inside. I think the temp was too high 94. ,1112633857678
205.175.225.22,Tom,04 Apr 2005,kickin_it_up_a_notch@yahoo.com,I pressed this into a hard cheese.The last three times the mozzarella cheese has turned out WONDERFUL.This last weekend‚ I made my best batch ever without using the stove. OK I used the stove for sterilization and for spinning. I heated my milk mixture in my 5 gallon pot using hot tap water in the sink. I preheated my 4 gallons of milk in their plastic milk jugs during equipment sterilization. The heat transfer properties of water makes for a faster temperature rise without any chance of scorching. One gallon of 135 deg water will heat 1 gallon of 45 deg milk to 90 deg (ignoring any heat ,1112633857678
205.175.225.22,Tom,04 Apr 2005,kickin_it_up_a_notch@yahoo.com,losses). It took about 1/3rd the time I needed on the stove. I also used hot tap water to reheat the cut curd.Thanks so much for the information on your site.,1112633857678
4.4.70.242,Mythili Sriram,06 Apr 2005,mythili_sriram@hotmail.com,In your recipe for Panir‚ you use Vinegar. If you use Buttermilk available from the grocery store you will get a better product as it does not give out an unpleasant odor and panir texture is also better. ,1112841674282
10.230.100.27,David F.,07 Apr 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Tom: Congrats on your successful mozzarella! This cheese is a challenge until one learns the ropes. Using hot tap water successfully obviously depends on the temp of your hot water. My home hot water is not hot enough. Thanks for the alternate heating method.
Mythili: Excellent suggestion. I agree that I would rather not have a vinegar taste‚ even if slight. However‚ the recipe I received and others I have seen call for vinegar. Is butermilk readily available in India‚ and is panir traditionally made with it? What proportions are used?,1112883280668
81.168.88.232,Walter,08 Apr 2005,rolywalter@hotmail.com,I'm currently making some goat's cheese: I've hung the bag of curds now for about 12 hours - still very moist and squeezing it produces some whey. At what point should I stop hanging it? It has a slightly rubbery texture which can broken up and packed into a small container (which I've done with a sample) - the texture resembles curdled eggs perhaps. In your Neufchatel recipe - when you add the salt do you rub it in to the lump in the picture‚ or do you actually crumble it up and then pack it? Does this crumbling affect the texture?,1112960983805
69.161.222.174,David F.,09 Apr 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Walter: Step 12 on the Neufchatel page tells you to work the salt in. The cheese is moist and soft. One could press it if you want a firmer cheese‚ but Neufchatel is usually used like a spreadable cheese. Take a look also at my Farmer's Cheese page. It is similar to Neufchatel.,1113054733515
62.90.139.62,Margaret,18 Apr 2005,mji_kkkiwi@hotmail.co.il,My friend with the sheep and goats really loves the fetta recipe. The brine is quite milky and white-ish tho'. When I would make it in my kibbutz dairy it would be clear and stay so. D'you think we could add CaCl to it . I know the cheese would then be firmer too.,1113854014888
62.90.139.62,margaret,18 Apr 2005,mji_kkkiwi@hotmail.co.il,Just read that "panir" recipe. Where is it from. Many cultures have a vinegar cheese. We in the kibbutzim call this by various names -usually the name of the person or kibbutz who gave us the recipe. We put salt tho' (200g kg to 5 litres of milk).Let it sit for 5 min after you have the separation then add salt and let sit 15 min before pouring out to the cloth. Ready the next day if you put 5kg weight on it. It has a slightly sweet taste. Btw Have you heard of fig as a coagulating agent?,1113855027232
200.18.51.2,Carlos Alberto Frana Ribeiro,19 Apr 2005,carribeiro@email.unaerp.br,Dear Doctor Fankhauser‚I would like to congratulate you for the quality of the infformations left on your home page. I've read the "ricotta making illustrated" and did not read nothing about the whey acidity correction‚ before heating. I do this procedure in order to avoid protein destruction‚ leading to higher yelds. Dont reduce the whey acidity?Thanks in advance‚Best regardsCarlos ,1113930450130
205.188.116.67,Ian Graydon,22 Apr 2005,Barkwaytreeser@aol.com,Thank you very much for all the work you put into this fantastic website. It answers many of the questions I have‚ and is greatly appreciated. You are a great teacher‚ and very generous with the knowledge you developed with your work. I am curious if you know any of the steps used to make my (a Canadian) favourite cheese‚ Oka‚ from Quebec. Please let me know.,1114151424093
10.230.100.27,David F.,22 Apr 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Margaret: I think cloudiness of brine may be due to the pH of the brine being too high. (This can cause the cheese to soften as well.) Try making the brine with whey and see if that helps. Panir is a cheese common in India (source of this recipe)‚ but yes‚ many cultures around the world make a version of it.
Carlos: Producing ricotta curd only works with lowered pH to aid heat denaturation of albumin. I have not heard of "correcting" the acidity. Tell us more if you like. Too high pH‚ no curd forms.
Ian: I am not familiar with Oka cheese. What can you tell us? ,1114179463382
213.237.55.236,peter,24 Apr 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Margaret / David:
Re: Cloudy brine..3 factors to look out for if you are having brine problems:
pH - you really want it to have close to the same pH as the cheese ( 5.2-5.3‚ typically ). Adding whey to the brine can help fix this. If you can get your hands on food grade hydrochloric acid this can also be used
Salt concentration: Optimum concentration is around 20%‚ The cheese starts to develop a slimy surface if the concentration gets close to 16% or lower. The slimy surface is partially dissolved cheese‚ that can turn the brine milky
,1114361661088
213.237.55.236,peter,24 Apr 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Adding a little CaCl2 to the brine isnt a bad idea at all.. Typically it is recommended to have 0.1-0.2% CaCl2 in the brine. Too little CaCl2 in the brine can affect the cheese in the same way as lack of salt in the brine..
I'd start by looking at pH and Salt content in the brine‚ then possibly add a little CaCl2
Problems? - Email me,1114361661088
69.161.222.174,David F.,24 Apr 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Thank you again Peter! It is wonderful to have someone knowledgable in the finer details of cheese making help us out with these details. I can see that calcium might tighten up the surface of brined cheeses. Never tried adding it to the brine.,1114392928781
148.61.1.77,Amy,25 Apr 2005,conea@gvsu.edu,I'm learning about correcting acidity from James Aldrich's archived site‚which I found by following the links in Barbara Harick's email at the bottom of Fankhauser's wonderful cheese page! My first batch of neufchatel was sour‚ so I began to look for the reason(s) why. Mr. Aldrich offers detailed information on how to create the flavor you want by contolling titretable acidity-- different from ph‚ he says-- but I do not know how those are different‚ nor have I been able to find the proper type of acidometer to measure acidity as recommended by him....anyone????,1114447667093
213.237.55.236,peter,26 Apr 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Amy: Describe the sour taste? Did you follow the recipe ?.. Typically cheese can become sour if you have too much whey left in it‚ or the pressing / hanging temperature is too high..If the cheese tasted "yoghurty" you could try making it at a lower temperature next time ( 20C usually works fine for that kind of cheese )‚ or try a different brand of buttermilk,1114550947809
148.61.1.77,Amy,27 Apr 2005,conea@gvsu.edu,Peter: I followed the recipe‚ but I let the formed curd sit too long. It tasted sour right away after hanging. Subsequent attempts have proved much better! Thanks! ,1114602764734
200.18.51.2,Carlos Alberto Franca Ribeiro,28 Apr 2005,carribeiro@email.unaerp.br,Dear Doctor‚ to attenuate the pH of the whey is interesting in the first step of heating‚ in order to protect the lactoalbumin and lactoglobulin against excessive denaturation‚ which leads to poorests yelds. Beginning with the initial aciditidy of 8 oDornic works well. When reaching about 80 oC‚ we proceed the acidification to 45 oDornic to increase the positive charge‚ prommoting more binding points between denatured proteins (near to the isoeletric point)which have negative residual charge. Working with low pH values when heating promotes excessive denaturation and lower coagulability‚ incre,1114706157734
200.18.51.2,Carlos Alberto Franca Ribeiro,28 Apr 2005,carribeiro@email.unaerp.br,(cont.) increasing protein losses. To write will be always a pleasure and I hope it could be helpfull‚ Carlos,1114706157734
207.245.14.100,Lori,29 Apr 2005,macpherson_lori@yahoo.ca,I've just started to learn how to make cheese. I began with a batch of Brie. I followed the instructions precisely. It looked wonderful right up to 3 weeks of ripening when I noticed a soft spot on the side. I cut open the round and the rest of the consistency was fine. However‚ it smelled sour. A nibble confirmed my suspicion. The whole lot was sour! Does anyone have any suggestions/ideas that might help? I don't want to make anymore cheese without knowing what I did wrong here. Thanks.,1114780989721
69.161.222.174,David F.,30 Apr 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Lori: I encourage beginning cheese makers to work their way up to challenging cheeses like brie. Take a look at my Beginning Cheese Making page. As far as sour brie (do you mean bitter rather than sour?) If sour‚ did you taste the curd when you first made the cheese? It may have been sour at that point. Was the inoculum pure and active? Were the rigorous curing temp and humidity carefully followed? You need to understand the general critical factors in making cheese ,1114870133187
24.57.43.153,Michelle,30 Apr 2005,fdsja@hotmail.com,I am shocked about what you can do with all these ingredients! Such as taking the whey from making cheese and making ricotta cheese with it! ITS BRILLIANT!,1114913359609
213.237.55.236,peter,03 May 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Michelle: Apart from making Ricotta from the whey‚ the whey is dried to form a powder used in many snack foods‚ mainly because the proteins left in the whey have an ability to bind water. Bodybuilders pay a fortune for whey powder as a nutritional supplement.. Over here the leftover whey is treated with formic acid and used to feed pigs. If not treated with the acid the pigs will eat themselves to death.. Btw: Many people use fresh whey as the wet ingredient in breadmaking ( I believe David has a recipe that on this site.. ),1115075147001
200.18.51.2,Carlos,03 May 2005,carlosafribeiro@yahoo.com,Peter and Michelle: The whey is also used in a widde range of processed products‚ such as ice cream‚ chocolate... and some industries use as raw material to produce oligopeptides for parenteral nutrition‚ in hospitalar use. What once was a polluent residue‚ today is a valluable by-product. Best regards‚ Carlos,1115132261360
69.161.222.174,David F.,03 May 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Peter‚ et al: Interesting thread on uses of whey. I am pretty sure there are folks in the USA with too much whey who spray it on their land. My whey-supplimented bread did not rise well. I'm pretty certain that it is too acid for yeast to grow well. Carlos' point about "correcting" the acidity of whey may be especially important as an ingredient in bread. Perhaps substituting baking soda for salt woulod help. Anyone have experience here?,1115162027609
213.237.55.236,peter,05 May 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,We typically produce around 3.000 to 3.500 tons of whey per week.. This whey is concentrated slightly using reverse osmosis and most of it is sent for further processing at another facility.
The leftover whey that isnt sold as pig feed is still dumped in the farmers fertilizer tanks‚ and according to the farmers its great for this..
Re: Breadmaking: I have no clue about what pH the yeast prefers‚ but I have made bread with great success using the whey from "drained yoghurt" ( I will explain this later ). The main difference being: No sugar and no molasses.. ,1115324423443
213.237.55.236,peter,05 May 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Drained yoghurt:
A trick I learned from some vegetarian friends of mine
Get some plain yoghurt ( or make your own ).. Place a coffee filter in a funnel‚ place funnel over a jar‚ fill the filter with yoghurt and leave overnight in the fridge.. Use it as a spread in sandwiches etc.,1115324423443
213.237.55.236,peter,05 May 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Oh.. btw: This product is derived from the lactose in whey‚ so it would seem that they whey is turning into gold at the moment: http://www.gaio-tagatose.com/
I have absolutely NO clues about the production process of this‚ but from what I have been told its not simple :-),1115324423443
10.230.100.27,David F.,06 May 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Peter: What you call "drained yogurt" is a traditional spreadable cheese of the Middle East. Here is my page on it‚ called Laban or Labneh. It is delicious drizzled with olive oil‚ mint sprinkled on top‚ and eaten with pita slices. Yum.,1115396627803
200.18.51.2,Carlos,09 May 2005,carlosafribeiro@yahoo.com,About breadmaking: The yeast metabolism ("Saccharomyces" species) is not affected at pH values from 3‚5 to 7‚0. Lower values will be suitable for a few groups of bacteria‚ what is desirable in most cases. The "Saccharomices" are not able to use lactose (exception to "S. kefir")and the amount of required sugar must be added. Therefore‚ the competitive bacterias present in the whey will also eat this sugar and lower the CO2 formation. Perhaps cooking previously the whey will kill the bacteria for the yeast grow free. ,1115652200920
216.78.71.30,Millie,14 May 2005,willsmamamillie@yahoo.com,I haven't read all the comments‚ but I wanted to post and thank you for this excellent site. Your yogurt page helped me immensely and I was delighted to find your cheesemaking instructions! I am unable to find organic cheeses locally and had no idea how easy it would be to make my own. My young son is enjoying and learning from this as well as I am...we just wanted to thank you for taking the time to put these wonderful pages up!,1116066977281
68.227.177.46,sylvia,17 May 2005,sylvy@cox.net,my fresh goats milk started smelling extreamly sour after i added buttermilk that i had cultured and frozen from the previous chevre i had made which had turned out just fine. should i throw it out‚ or can it be eaten even though i didnt pasteurize the milk.,1116387987859
10.230.100.27,David F.,18 May 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Sylvia: Actually‚ "sour" is technically a taste‚ not a smell. If your buttermilk smells spoiled or tastes bitter (from contamination)‚ then I would not use it. However‚ if it is only very sour‚ that should not be a problem. Contamination would come either from starter or the milk. I would purchase fresh buttermilk‚ be very careful about milk handling‚ and incubate only until the milk thickens. That should take care of it.,1116426999022
63.84.92.38,Jessica,26 May 2005,superiorsoaps@pasty.com,I was wondering if you sell your cheese and if so do you need a licence or health inspector to check out your facilities?Or can you just do it out of a certifies kitchen?I make jam and soap (for home use not sale)so I was thinking of trying my hand at cheese but i know some people that make and sell jam and was just wondering if the licensing or what ever they do is the same.If you are not sure do you know any one that would know?Thank you for the great knowledgeJessica C.,1117117938789
69.161.216.175,David F.,26 May 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Jessica: The regulations on selling dairy products are quite strict. In many states‚ homestead milk can be sold as "pet milk." My understanding is that the legal hoops are high and difficult to be able to sell homestead cheese. Do not plan on selling of any scale unless you build a milk house and a cheese house to strict standards and inspections. Raw milk cheese must be aged 60 days to ensure no pathogens. Sharing with friends is murky...,1117120972937
62.90.139.15,margaret,27 May 2005,mji_kkkiwi@hotmail.co.il,You can use whey as a facial and skin toner. (Just don't leave it on till it dries)I agree that whey in bread is less sucessful (but not inedible). Maybe dilute it 50-50 with water,1117159226937
207.200.116.12,Trini,26 May 2005,pinquiesista@aol.com,I will like to make a 6-8 cups milk 2%how much rennet and I have tried it but I do not get a clean break!,1117170306166
69.161.216.175,David F.,28 May 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Trini: Without knowing what steps your followed‚ it is hard to know where the problem might be. I would refer you to two pages: Beginning Cheese Making and Trouble Shooting Clean Break Problems,1117288225812
213.237.55.236,peter,30 May 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, David / Jessica:
Over here in Scandinavia many smaller organic farms make and sell cheese‚ but they are subject to the same inspections by the health inspector as the larger places. The problem with this is that it costs a small fortune to build the proper facilities and conduct the nescesary quality control‚ so the products end up being very expensive. In turn this would mean that you have to make some unique products to justify the high cost. I would start by learning and perfecting a couple of products even before thinking of getting licensed. I dont know anything about the pro,1117445567332
213.237.55.236,peter,30 May 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, I dont know anything about the procedures and regulations in the US‚ but my guess is that they are pretty much indentical‚ so feel free to email me with any questions,1117445567332
65.249.15.35,Cheri,11 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,David/Jessica: I'm sure different states (and counties) in the US have different rules. In Colorado‚ if you want to sell even goat milk soap at a farmer's market you have to make it in a commercial kitchen. Home made cheese isn't allowed for sale at the farmer's market. You need to decide how/where you want to sell potential products and contact whomever is in charge of that venue to find out what the rules are. I would expect to be able to get that information from the county extension offices too. ,1118520446660
65.249.15.35,Cheri,11 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,An interesting note on bypassing the "rules" about not being able to sell raw milk except for pet food: In Colorado (perhaps elsewhere) there is a loophole wherein you can sell shares in your livestock; then whomever buys shares in your animals‚ then gets to share in the output without problems. For example‚ I have sheep and want to sell raw sheep milk to my neighbors. But that's not legal‚ for human consumption. So I sell them a share in my sheep‚ and in return they get X amount of milk as a return on their investment. I love that idea‚ don't you? :-) ,1118520446660
65.249.15.35,Cheri,11 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,By the way‚ thank you for this wonderfully helpful site. I'm just now learning to make cheeses and yoghurt and butter‚ and there is SOOO much to learn. The photos and descriptions are very easy to follow. thanks for the time you spend keeping this site fresh. I'd like some help with questions about making butter‚ also - can you help? ,1118520446660
69.161.216.62,David F.,12 Jun 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Cheri: Thanks for your posts. I have only made butter a few times‚ and I believe that Peter will be able to answer more authoritatively‚ but here is what I understand:
1) Slight acidification improves separation out of the butter fat. Try 1-2 tsp buttermilk/quart of cream‚ overnight at room temp.
2) The churning temperature is critical‚ I believe the optimum is around 61 F. Too cold‚ the flakes don't stick together‚ too warm they don't separate out well.
3) All whey must be well worked out or the butter won't keep.
Peter?,1118592687109
65.249.15.35,cheri bradbury,12 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,
David: Thanks for the help. Now I'm wondering why my ice cream maker does not work as a butter churn? It seems like it should work - but I just had it running with a quart of cream in it for over an hour and not 1 little dab of butter has formed.
I've had inconsistent results and I'd like to hit on one method that works.
I'm looking forward to Peter weighing in? Thanks much :-) ,1118611203133
65.249.15.35,cheri bradbury,12 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,FYI - I'm using goat milk‚ not cow. I have a DeLaval 14 cream separator that we just got cleaned and functional after about a year of fiddling with it. Usually I have let the milk sit in the refrigerator for a day or two as I collect more milk. Then on one day‚ I separate about 9 gallons at a time. I have tried making butter immediately from the warm milk (I warm it to about 90 degrees F prior to separating)‚ tried chilling the milk in the refrigerator overnight‚ and a few experiments in between. So far I have not been able to consistently churn butter. ,1118611203133
65.249.15.35,cheri bradbury,12 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,(cont.) Other than the abortive attempt with the ice cream maker‚ I've been using 1-gallon jars as churns - I fill it 1/2 with cream‚ then rock the jar until the butter forms (hopefully). A couple of times I got over a pint of butter from 1/2 gallon of cream. Other times I got nothing.
Thanks for any advice and help :-) ,1118611203133
65.249.15.35,cheri,12 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,Yoghurt help needed: David‚ I tried to follow your instructions for making yogurt. I don't have a cooler quite like in the photo‚ but have 2 similar (smaller) ones‚ plus 2 Salton yoghurt makers - a quart size and 1 that holds the little jars. I dutifully heated and cooled the milk to the temps you specify‚ added the yogurt (organic vanilla‚ could not find plain) and put it into various containers - 1 quart har each in a Playmate single cooler‚ a larger similar type cooler‚ and the 2 Saltons. ,1118611203133
65.249.15.35,cheri,12 Jun 2005,writergrrrl48@netscape.net,After 3 hours‚ nothing happened. I checked the temps in the coolers and they were still around 120F. I don't think the Saltons get that hot though. I left them all overnight - the jars in the cooler never jelled‚ although they got a bit thicker when I filled the containers with more hot water and left them 2 more hours. The 2 Salton makers made fairly decent yoghurt‚ although it is runny not "set".
Any advice on improving the technique so I get consistent results with the coolers? I'd prefer to use a non-electric method. Thanks!,1118611203133
69.161.216.62,David F.,13 Jun 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Cheri: "Organic" yogurt does not mean that the bacteria are alive and well... Indeed‚ unless it sells well‚ it might sit on the shelf long enough for the bacteria to die. Please try to find Dannon Plain for starter. Get the one with the most distant expiration date.,1118707736906
213.237.55.236,peter,16 Jun 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Cheri / David: First of all: The ideal separation temperature is 50-55 C ( feel free to convert to Fahrenheit :-)
Second: I just uploaded a guide to buttermaking on a "slightly" larger scale compared to what you are doing. It can be found here: http://www.naeslund.dk/peter/files/cheese/butterbasics.pdf
Making butter from milk will work‚ but is very inefficient compared to making it from cream. The ideal fat content depends on the churn used‚ but generally its somewhere between 30 and 40%
Let me know if you have more questions,1118948962037
213.237.55.236,peter,17 Jun 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Perhaps I should point out that when I am talking about separation temperature I am talking about the temperature of the milk as it enters a centrifugal separator‚ the purpose of wich is to skim the cream off the milk‚ NOT make butter..,1119015352903
85.64.196.132,margaret,23 Jun 2005,mji_kkkiwi@hotmail.co.il,Cheri‚ I would think an ice cream maker too gentle. The whole point is to whack the proverbial sh-t out of the cream.There is no non-violent way to make butter. I would try a food processor. Use the knife-y regular blade so as not to get too much air in it‚ then once you have the curd nice and crumbly put it in a sieve and rinse in very cold water (10 deg Celsius) 3 or 4 times.Till it runs off clear. (Don't let it get into a solid ball at the churning stage or the whey gets trapped "inside")Good luck.There is nothing like homemade butter,1119499007795
24.247.191.236,Pam,24 Jun 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,I make butter from my fresh cream skimmed off the top of the goat milk using the shaker jar I got with ranch dressing mix‚ I just fill it and hand it to the kids‚ takes as long as 15 minutes‚ but I get a good amount when I am done,1119648470790
24.247.191.236,Pam,24 Jun 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,is there any way to salvage the cheese if you DON'T get a clean break? I tried leaving the cultured milk overnight for the first time before adding the rennet and had my first failure‚ but hate to just throw away 2 gallons of milk!,1119648742494
69.161.216.62,David F.,26 Jun 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Margaret:
Ironically‚ I have ACCIDENTLY made butter in my ice cream maker if I do not take the ice cream out soon enough! But I think you are right‚ a certain vigorousness is needed to have the butter "come." I prefer to make ice cream with the cream I skim‚ but I should try butter according to your post.
Pam:If the milk has clabbered‚ you can make a labneh-style soft cheese (drain through a fine cloth). Do you now know why it did not give a clean break? ,1119821044640
213.237.55.236,peter,29 Jun 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Pam: You left the milk over night before adding rennet?
Normally I'd suggest leaving the milk at 30C for an hour with the starter culture‚ then add rennet and leave overnight.. You could also add the rennet just after you got the starter mixed in
At work we leave the milk for 30 minutes at 28-34C ( depends on recipe )‚ add rennet and let it sit for 30-40 minutes and we have no problems getting a clean break.. The only difference is that we use a continously grown fresh and active starter,1120048040304
69.161.216.152,David F.,29 Jun 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Peter and Pam: I have made several kinds of cheeses over the years in which starter is added the previous night‚ and rennet added in the morning (see my basic hard cheese). It is very important to add the correct amount of starter. Fresh active buttermilk starter mesophilic) is particularly aggressive acidifier which must be added sparingly. These days‚ I add 3 Tbl/5 gal milk (approx. 45 mL/20 L). If the milk is too acid‚ the curd falls apart. Yogurt (thermophilic) as starter is much more forgiving. I add a cup/5 gal (250 mL/20 L).,1120060974796
213.237.55.236,peter,30 Jun 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, David: Assuming you leave it overnight at room temp. ( 20C? ) it should be fine‚ but it just sounds like its way overkill to leave it that long ( never tried it ).. However I have added the rennet just a few minutes after the starter.. This helps a lot if your starter is semi bad
Using a yoghurt starter is obviously slower as the optimum temperature for these bacteria is close to 40C. Growing them at room temperature slows them down considerably. One problem I do see about using yoghurt as a starter is the potential lack of eyes being formed in the cheese during the ageing.. ,1120143827469
213.237.55.236,peter,30 Jun 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Typically we add 0.4 to 2% fresh starter.. If the mesiphilic starter is too agressive you might want to keep it in the fridge for a day or 2 before using it.. I cant explain why but it seems to slow it down to a more usable point,1120143827469
24.247.191.236,Pam,06 Jul 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,thanks for the input...I just fed it to the squash plants. I guess my starter was too strong to leave that long I had never had a batch fail like that before‚ I will go back to putting the culture in for an hour‚ then rennet‚ that always seems to work well for me. I just tasted my first batch of Saint Maure (I may have spelled that wrong) aged for 3 weeks‚ my first moldy cheese!,1120664776754
63.245.150.176,gregory r nichols,09 Jul 2005,nqhranch @twinvalley.net,We have now wasted 6 gallons of goats milk just trying to get curds from breaking into tiny bits. We did not squeeze or stir curds roughly. Please let us know what is wrong. How long must you cook curds normally to acieve the scrambled egg consistency? HELP we are trying to enter cheese at the 4 h fair on 23 july and we are without.... Thank you,1120940860280
69.162.117.197,David F.,10 Jul 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Gregory: Did you follow one of my recipes or some other? The precise steps you performed is crucial to diagnosing the problem. It sounds as though your milk was over acidified. If you are a first time cheese maker‚ I strongly recommend following the stages listed on my Beginning Cheese Making page. See also Trouble shooting clean break failure.,1121010699921
213.237.55.236,peter,12 Jul 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Gregory: Are you getting a good break when cutting the coagulated milk ?
Another common problem could be that you are stirring too hard.. You could try letting the curds sit for a few minutes before you start stirring.. Also.. Stirring for a while before starting cooking helps a bit too
Do you pasteurise the milk?. If so how hot and how long ? Pasteurising too hard tends to give some strange results
Producing cheese with such short notice will probably only leave time for something like Feta though..If you are in deep trouble and really need cheese made fast‚ I'd be glad to ,1121124296885
213.237.55.236,peter,12 Jul 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, I'd be glad to fly in and make some feta with you if you pay the travel expenses :-)good luck,1121124296885
61.16.232.18,S K Sharma,20 Jul 2005,sksharma@donaldsonindia.com,Excellent site for knowledge and to try ourself. Thanks to Mr. Fankhauser's.,1121844154406
207.200.116.12,Harry Persaud,22 Jul 2005,HPer990676@aol.com,I am in dire need to get the recipe to make Quesillo‚ a Mexican strubg cheese. Could you be of help. This cheese is rolled up like a ball of twine and it shreds like strands of hair. Please help. My phone is (415) 756-2233,1122096921017
69.162.117.197,David F.,23 Jul 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Harry: I have never made a string cheese‚ but I believe this is what you are describing. I am paretty sure that the curd is allowed to get acid‚ is then heated‚ and pulled like taffy as it cools. Anyone out there ever made it?,1122146885890
203.160.176.43,Jose Porferio M. Lesidan III,27 Jul 2005,doggydog@kittymal.com,Wonderful site! I have been looking for books or sites about cheese making for quite sometime now. What a blessing it is for me to accidentally "stumble" on your site. I learned so many things and I am very excited on starting my little cheese hobby.God bless you Dr. Fankhauser and more power!,1122467026100
65.8.72.108,bill,03 Aug 2005,uncbilkw@bellsouth.net,as i live in key west‚ my room temp is about 90 F in the summer. i've tried citric acid with better results than buttermilk‚ but never have gotten a "clean" break. yields vary enormously‚ i'm using a rennet liquid from the dairy connection. i notice that both over and under acidified stuff is a problem‚ but never have i seen a recommended PH for the milk before adding rennet.any suggestions?thanks much‚ bill,1123063807380
69.162.117.197,David F.,04 Aug 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Bill: The pH optimum for rennet is 5.8‚ but if using bacterial starters‚ you will want to add rennet around 6.0 so that it does not become over acidified‚ leading to fragile curd which is VERY difficult to harvest. I presume you have looked at my web page on trouble shooting clean break failure.,1123167686468
217.20.243.154,AYO,11 Aug 2005, ayus2j@yahoo.com,Hi. I have been looking for books or websites about cheese & youghurt for quite along time now. What a good day is today that i found it on your websites . Thanks ‚ May God bless you& give you more wisdom & understanding .Dr. Fankhauser,1123745162765
67.76.182.128,Matt,13 Aug 2005,mattsisco@gmail.com,Hello‚ thank you so much for making a site like this! I just started making cheese and apparently Mozzerella is one of the hardest ones to make =P Anyways‚ I am having 0-2 on getting a clean break and most of your troublshooting concerns recipes which call for over night inoculation when I am trying to use citric acid. Is there any advice you could give as to why it isn't working? I would most apreciate it. Thanks again!,1123906677000
69.162.117.197,David F.,14 Aug 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Matt: American mozzarella should actually be a fairly easy cheese‚ but not as easy as yogurt and buttermilk... Carefully measure the amount of citric acid‚ the volume of milk and the temperature of the milk. Also‚ is the rennet fresh enough? Tablets last longer than liquid‚ but not forever. If in doubt‚ use a whole tablet rather than 1/2.,1124044717953
24.167.63.29,Zsuzsa Prigge,18 Aug 2005,UPRIGGE@Houston.rr.com,Dear Dr Frankhauser‚my husband and I have just spent a delightful week in Colorado on an organic goat and flower farm . We learned much about organic farming‚ cheesemaking‚marketing.Yet‚ reading Your web page I have learned even more about cheesemaking. Being a pharmacist I've read the scientific links with great interest. In all things I have alwaysmaintained that fundametal understanding of the ways things workare the only way we are able to modify our behaviour on the long run. So ‚please‚ do not underestimate your visitors: do provide them with as much scienceas possible even in a subject,1124386957620
71.0.103.85,Matt,22 Aug 2005,mattsisco@gmail.com,Thanks for the help with the mozzarella‚ however I still haven't gotten a clean break. I measured everything precisely abd heated the milk exactly and obtained fresh rennet. My only other guess could be the calcium issue with store bought milk. I am going to buy some Calcium Chloride soon but I read that if you use the CaCl2 in mozzarella then it doesn't spin properly. Do you know anything about that‚ whether it is true or not? ,1124756983201
69.162.117.197,David F.,26 Aug 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Matt: You are still trying to make American mozzarella? I have made it with store bought milk. For a gallon of milk‚ you must be exact about 1 1/4 tsp citric acid (be sure it is citric acid). Even if you just bought the rennet‚ it might not be fresh. Try using a whole rennet tablet. Follow the temps exactly. I can't believe that you won't get a clean break! Do not disturb it while it is coagulating. CaCl2 firms up the curd if required. I don't know what effect i might have on spin. Peter‚ do you know? ,1125082753328
207.255.104.243,Matt,28 Aug 2005,mattsisco@gmail.com,This is getting really frustrating now. I went over to visit my girlfriend in PA where it is not illegal to sell fresh milk‚ unlike NJ. I made some Mozzarella for the pizza later that day‚ but still no clean break. I don't get it. In the end it doesn't seem to matter becaue out of 4 gallons of milk I probably got 3 pounds of cheese‚ so the recipe still works. This time it was really odd though because after it coagulated as much as it was going to I went to reheat it to 108 degrees and the curd melted together as it began to precipitate. Which is absolutely perfect for Mozzarella‚ so I was gre,1125236372120
207.255.104.243,Matt,28 Aug 2005,mattsisco@gmail.com,I also tried making Neufchatel the other day and it worked out just fine (still no clean break though) except that I let it dry out too long so it became crumbly instead of spreadable. It was still excellent on salads‚ almost like feta. Well I am having a blast with all of this. I hope you all have a wonderful day!,1125236372120
69.162.117.197,David F.,30 Aug 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Matt: OK‚ listen (closely)--I do not know how much experience making cheese you have‚ but your difficult getting a clean break on any cheese you make suggests to me that you would profit by looking closely at my page on Beginning Cheese Making. It has staged projects which‚ once mastered‚ lay the foundation for more complex cheeses. ,1125426894500
213.237.55.236,peter,02 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Matt/David Adding a little CaCl2 wouldnt hurt and shouldnt interfere with the stretching/spinning.
The main reason for wanting a clean break is to reduce the quantity of cheese lost in the whey.. This loss will be minor because the cloth you use when pressing catches most of the small particles.. However: You still want to make sure the curd breaks‚ but it doesnt have to be perfect..
What pH does the 1 1/4 tsp of citric acid bring the milk down to?.. Ideally you want it somewhere between 5.2 and 5.3 ,1125656710195
67.126.76.115,Jim Mulligan,12 Sep 2005,jim@ranchopaloma.com,Mr. Fankhauser‚First‚ I've loved experimenting with your recipes. Very straightforward and easy to follow. I have a question about milk pasteurization. Does freshly expressed milk need to be cooled prior to pasteurization or can I pasteurize it immediately? It seems as though I can but I can't find an answer anywhere about this specific question.Thanks‚Jim,1126553890390
67.126.76.115,Jim,12 Sep 2005,jim@ranchopaloma.com,I'm sorry‚ I should have addressed you as Dr. Fankhauser.,1126558026078
24.247.191.236,Pam,13 Sep 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,I was reading about cheeses as I try your recipe for blue cheese‚ and read about cabrales‚ I found several sources for it (very expensive) but am wondering if I could inoculate with a blendered slurry of a little of it amd make my own cabrales‚ or would it just be blue cheese?,1126637903124
213.237.55.236,peter,13 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Jim: The only reason for cooling the milk before pasteurising is if you need to store it for a while before you have enough to pasteurise a batch.If it takes you several hours to complete the milking process I would cool the milk in smaller batches though.. At milking temperature the milk is an excellent growth media for bacteria‚ so pasteurise immediately or cool to 3-5C ASAP.. ,1126645570216
213.237.55.236,peter,13 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Pam: I just read the info here: www.cheesesupply.comAnd apart from it being made from mixed milk (cow‚ sheep and goat ) and being aged in caverns ( caverns used for cheese aging usually have a pretty unique flora compared to the controlled conditions in the traditional cheese ageing facilities at dairies. This can affect the taste. ) you shouldnt have any problems using the Cabrales as an innoculant.,1126645570216
24.247.191.236,Pam,13 Sep 2005,Hotoes40@yahoo.com,Peter: too bad I don't have a cavern! I have cow and goat milk‚ hope to have sheep in a year or so‚ I may try it down the road.thanks!,1126667757034
24.247.191.236,Pam,13 Sep 2005,Hotoes40@yahoo.com,has anyone tried cream cheese wax? I got some as I have a lot of mold here‚ stuff molds fast‚ but it smells awful‚ very chemical/petroleum‚ not sure I want to put that on my cheese,1126667757034
213.237.55.236,peter,15 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Pam:
Cream cheese wax?.. Commercial cheese wax is paraffin (cheap candle material ) with a little vaseline added to make it a little softer and more flexible
Another option is to use a plastic emulsion ( like latex paint‚ even smells like paint ).. This leaves a completely airtight skin on the cheese.. This can be good or bad depending on what kind of cheese you are making.. The emulsion is typically used on stuff like Emmenthal,1126773225195
213.237.55.236,peter,15 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Pam:
You shouldnt have any problems using the Cabrales as an innoculant‚ and doing so may even bring you close to the original‚ but I wont make any guarantees :-),1126773225195
24.247.191.236,pam,15 Sep 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,it's the plastic emulsion‚ it's exactly like latex paint! they call it cream cheese wax on the container.I am just a little concerned that the smell will go into the cheese. I have bees‚ and so beeswax‚ would that work on cheese?,1126803001023
69.162.113.97,David F.,15 Sep 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Been away to Turkey‚ N. Greece‚ Macdeonia (visited a cheese factory ih Bitola)‚ Albania and Italy in the last ten days and was not able to answer questions. It looks like "peter" did us all a service by fielding some questions (as he has so expertly done before). Bravo!,1126836508343
68.3.21.200,Stephen,16 Sep 2005,Bluemilk@yahoo.com,Hey i loooooooooove what your doing at this web sight im having trouble make farmers cheese though iv tried 4 times now and i got another batch tonight iv had a hard time getiing a clean break accually any curd forming at all iv already did the yoghurt and labneh so any tips also tell me if theres anything specile that would help im only 12 but i could manage,1126924386671
68.3.21.200,Stephen,16 Sep 2005,Bluemilk92@yahoo.com, I forgot to say that ?do i need a cheese cloth because i just cut a big square out of my white cotton t-shirts those are a fine weave i staralise them i was wondering if theres anything wrong with that,1126925351093
80.103.121.18,Beth,17 Sep 2005,cook@spain.tc,Thanks so much for your site...just wondering‚ can kefir be used as a starter instead of buttermilk? ,1126939033780
69.162.113.97,David F.,17 Sep 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Stephen: Please look a my page on trouble shooting failure to get a clean break.
Sterile white cotton cloth is fine for draining curd (T shirt or otherwise‚ boiled and dryed).
Beth:
I think you might be able to use kefir as a starter‚ but I have not tried it. Adjust the proportions and amount to produce good starting condidtions.,1126986450203
213.237.55.236,peter,19 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Pam: I have used the plastic emulsion type on hard emmenthal style cheese with no problem with the smell migrating into the cheese‚ however.. If your cheese is soft it is more sensitive to smell and flavor migration..
Using Bees wax may work.. I have never tried it‚ but I like the idea.. If I remember it right bees wax has a pretty distinct smell that may or may not migrate into the cheese‚ so dont use it on soft cheese if you dont want to risk the wax flavor migrating into the cheese..,1127143962980
213.237.55.236,peter,19 Sep 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Beth/ David: Kefir is made with a combination of lactic acid bacteria and yeasts.. The yeasts produces alcohol wich may or may not affect the active enzyme in the rennet.. Also: the alcohol and enzymes released by the yeasts may affect the flavor the cheese would develop under normal conditions.
This is definately an interesting experiment‚ and I'd love to hear more about the results if you try this!,1127143962980
204.111.21.241,jackie,19 Sep 2005,ipsolutions@onebox.com,I am trying to make Mozzarella‚ with no success (third try). I noticed mention of citric acid among the comments‚ but it is not in your recipe. Is it necessary? I cannot get the cheese to "spin"‚ it just falls apart‚ although I get a good clean break.,1127187863781
69.230.103.47,Josh,19 Sep 2005,pizza.guy@att.net,Hello: I'm a novice cheese head‚ but in my trials I have found that bees wax does not affect flavor -that being said it is horrible for using as a cheese wax- it cracks A LOT and does not allow for any contraction of your wheel-whether from handling Or cutting.I have a problem with over cooking my curds- At first I overheated them-killing my preserving bacilli- and spoilage (instead of ripening)Now I can't seem to get the consistency right- my curds do not gel together in my press- I am using about 25lbs. for 12 hours.I plan to use a water buffer during my heating process next time.Can anyone,1127197612828
69.230.103.47,Josh,19 Sep 2005,pizza.guy@att.net,Jackie_ About the mozz. Citric acid is used as an astringent in the curdling process- also white vinegar works wonders with out imparting any off flavor-but measurements must be exact- Take a look at Paneer/Panir- making this Indian cheese helped me learn a lot about coagulation I can describe the molding process of mozz. as exactly the same as balling pizza dough.,1127197612828
204.111.98.22,jackie,20 Sep 2005,ipsolutions@onebox.com,Josh‚ thanks‚ but I'm still not sure about your answer. Is the citric acid involved in making the cheese "spin"? Is it necessary? What else could be responsible for my lack of "spin"? My cheese seems to curdle fine‚ but doesn't get the pullable consistency.,1127228016390
212.56.128.184,Tony ,21 Sep 2005,tony@highway.com.mt,I am a newcomer to cheese making and would like to know how long to heat the goats milk‚ to pasterize it.,1127324467356
10.230.100.27,David F.,23 Sep 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Jackie‚ Josh and Tony: Glad to see this page works even when I can't get to it! I always suggest starting with easier cheese projects than Mozzarella. Italian is the best‚ but difficult (for me). American is easier‚ using citric acid to acidify for the spin. Proper spin is the most difficult part. Italian gets acid with bacteria. Pasteurization: 63 C for 30 minutes. HTST: 72 C for 15 sec‚ cool rapidly.,1127512574152
24.247.191.236,pam,24 Sep 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,I have made chevre with part kefir‚(very creamy and wonderful) have also drained kefir to make "cheese" like yogurt cheese? but whenever I use it in any other recipes it does not make a clean break.,1127613645940
69.162.113.97,David F.,26 Sep 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Pam: I would like to try making cheese using a kefir starter. I have none at the moment. If you could send me an ounce‚ I will let you know if I can figure out a way to use it as starter.
To use kefir as starter‚ one would have to filter out the grains before adding rennet‚ and adjudge the drop of the pH. Not to fast‚ and not too slow...,1127779743984
24.247.191.236,pam,28 Sep 2005,hotoes40@yahoo.com,David:I would be very happy to send you some kefir grains! there is a kefir site that has cheese recipes‚ but I was not able to get them to work‚ your expertise would be great! email me your address and I will get them in the mail‚ they are the real‚ live grains‚ do you need the care instructions? my email is hotoes40@yahoo.com ,1127906927625
195.93.21.6,robin onley,06 Oct 2005,robinonley58@aol.com,great followed recipe (success)only problem cheese stuck to cloth after pressing may be did'nt press hard,1128625017812
71.140.0.147,Josh ,07 Oct 2005,pizza.guy@att.net,David‚ I am having problems getting a clean break- I decreased the innoculation time to 7 hrs. @ my house. which works fine but I tried reducing the 5 gallon to a 3.5 gallon- all calculations aside no clean break what is the proper ph level for rennet activity and is it different for each style cheese? Thank you. ,1128678837406
10.230.100.27,David F.,07 Oct 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Robin: What cloth were you pressing in? Classic "cheesecloth" is NOT desireable. The weave is too coarse. I use boiled white handkerchiefs. I suspect this is the reason your cheese stuck.
Josh: The pH optimum for rennet stability (chymosin) according to the web is between 5.3 and 6.3. I would aim for around 6.0. Peter? What do you think? Adding rennet early is better than adding it late‚ for sure.,1128713782603
195.93.21.6,robin ,09 Oct 2005,robinonley58@aol.com,HELP We bought 5 gal of jersey milk of the farmer unpasteurised at 20 c put in two cups of yogurt at 30 c next day one teaspoon of rennet nothing happened this milk is one third cream too creamy perhaps ? can it be saved. maybe by adding bottled milk ?,1128867237906
195.93.21.6,robin ,09 Oct 2005,robinonley58@aol.com,HELP We bought 5 gal of jersey milk of the farmer unpasteurised at 20 c put in two cups of yogurt at 30 c next day one teaspoon of rennet nothing happened this milk is one third cream too creamy perhaps ? can it be saved. maybe by adding bottled milk ?,1128867237906
69.162.113.97,David F.,09 Oct 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Robin: You did not mention what recipe you were following. The yogurt is fresh and active? Did the milk still look JUST like milk the next AM (12 hrs)? (No thickening) Did you warm up the milk to 30 C before adding rennet? Is the rennet fresh? (I use rennet tablets‚ as you know.) I would have skimmed the cream‚ but that should not be a problem. Check clean break troubleshooting page.,1128875605265
213.237.55.236,peter,10 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Josh/David: In optimum conditions you typically add the rennet at pH around 6.0-6.5 depending on the type of cheese you are making.
David is right about the pH range for rennet activity
Is the whey just cloudy or do the curds fall apart when stirring gently? If the whey is just cloudy it wont matter a whole lot‚ but if the curds fall apart you might find it beneficial to add 2-4 grams of CaCL2 per 5 gallons of milk,1128904554786
213.237.55.236,peter,10 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Robin Sounds like bad rennet.. Get a cup of buttermilk at room temperature‚ add a few drops of rennet‚ mix it in... it should coagulate within an hour.. If nothing happens within the hour‚ your rennet is bad!
Rennet should be stored cold ( in the fridge ) and away from sunlight.Oh.. and never try to pasteurise the rennet‚ altho a good idea from a hygiene POV you will destroy the active enzymes in the rennet and render it useless.
Higher fat content in the milk just leaves you with softer curds and eventually softer cheese.,1128904554786
195.93.21.6,robin,10 Oct 2005,robinonley58@aol.com,Thanks fo your advice i doubled up on the rennet and in the hour it worked so i guess you were right. i don't know what affect this will have on the taste but the cheese lookes great.can you give me your views on unpasteurised cheese and is it difficult to do at home the farmer who sold me the milk has been drinking it for years. and i understand lots of french cheese is un pasteurised look forward to your reply,1128965195296
213.237.55.236,peter,11 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Robin: Adding too much rennet can make the cheese bitter tasting
I assume you are thinking about making cheese from unpasteurised milk? If this is the case there are a few things you should be aware of: 1: Filter the milk to remove straw‚ hair etc. 2: Use a fresh‚ active starter and use a little more than usual. 3: Add 1 gram og potassium or sodium nitrate per gallon of milk 4: Be extra careful about the hygiene when making the cheese.
,1128984109677
213.237.55.236,peter,11 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Since many of the pathogenic bacteria grow extremely well at the same temperatures as the starter bacteria‚ you need to give the starter the best conditions possible‚ so it can "take control" before the pathogens do it.
Adding nitrates (Food grade) prevents the coliform bacteria ( that you undoubtedly have in the raw milk ) from forming gas during the early part of the ripening stage and ruining the cheese. Later on in the process the nitrates are broken down to nitrites wich is extremely toxic to certain Clostridii ( also common in raw milk ) that otherwise may cause problems ,1128984109677
213.237.55.236,peter,11 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,during the last part of the ripening process ( making the cheese smell and taste like feet ).
There is no need to worry about adding nitrates in such small quantities to the cheese. During the ripening‚ the nitrates are broken down and are completely untraceable after 10 weeks or so
One warning though: If you are making swiss cheese you dont want to add nitrates as these kill some of the good bacteria in the special starter used for these types of cheese. It is also pointless to add to camembert and blue cheese since these cheeses in most cases are eaten before the clostridii start the,1128984109677
195.93.21.6,robin ,11 Oct 2005,robinonley58@aol.com,Thanks for your reply peter when you say add nitrates do you mean salt petre (one gram per gallon)if so thats what i use in my bacon curing ,1129021716093
213.237.55.236,peter,11 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, Nitrates: When I mention adding nitrates to the cheese I am talking about either potassium nitrate ( KNO3 ) or Sodium Nitrate ( NaNO3 )
If Saltpetre is household name for the same thing as here in denmark‚ then it is the right stuff to add‚ but check the container.
The legal limit here in denmark is 20 grams per 100 litres of milk‚ wich turns into approx 3/4 grams per gallon,1129039793767
213.237.55.236,peter,11 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Forgot to add:
Normally you add the potassium nitrate at the same time as you add the starter.. dissolve it in a cup of water and mix it in.,1129039793767
207.239.222.22,Yuyo,12 Oct 2005,yuyo@aol.com,Thank you for the info.Great site.YUYO,1129147768203
4.252.3.116,Lynn,20 Oct 2005,beumer@juno.com,I saw the recipe for Mascarpone cheese‚ using tartartic acid. Can cream of tartar be used instead? I checked one web site where I could order two oz of tartartic acid for 99c‚ but the minimum order was $10.00 ,1129833517953
10.230.100.16,David F.,20 Oct 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Lynn: Cream of tarter is a potassium salt of tartaric acid (only slightly acid compared to tartaric acid)‚ and therefore of little use if you are trying to acidify milk. Sorry. Did you ask the manager at your local supermarket? Alternatively‚ try a local wine making supply store. Wine makers use tartaric acid to adjust the pH of grape juice for ideal fermenting conditions. You might also try a store specializing in spices and flavorings‚ or even your local pharmacist.,1129842224329
4.255.245.189,Lynn,20 Oct 2005,beumer@juno.com,Thank you‚ David,1129850115328
213.237.55.236,peter,24 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk,Re: Mascarpone: Another option is using either citric acid or Glucono Delta Lacton (C6H10O6). I have tried the latter for homemade mascarpone and it works fine‚ but its not something you'd find in a supermarket here
No matter wich of these acids you decide to use‚ you really need to make sure you get it in Food Grade quality. Other grades may contain small amounts of toxic chemicals,1130104854342
69.162.113.97,David F.,24 Oct 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Lynn and Peter: When at my local brewery supplies (for the home brewer) house‚ I found an "Acid Blend: of citric‚ malic and tartaric acids‚ 2 oz for about $1.25. I am going to try making maxcarpone with it--I suspect it will work.,1130198832187
165.21.154.108,cynthia,26 Oct 2005,cynthia1689@gmail.com,hi...i would like to know how to detect if a yogurt was spoiled. As in what are the characteristics of a spoil yogurt (in terms of colour‚ taste‚ smell‚ texture‚ pH etc.).,1130369443820
10.230.100.16,David F.,27 Oct 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Cynthia: Properly made yogurt should be adequately tart with a pH of around 4.3 and keep for very long periods. I know of no pathogenic bacteria which could grow at this pH. Harmless mold‚ on the other hand‚ may grow on the surface at this pH. This may impart a slightly moldy flavor to the upper portion of the yogurt. You may still use the yogurt for cooking after pick off the mold or skim off the top 1/2 inch of yogurt.
If the yogurt never made properly and is still near pH 6.0‚ spoilage may be indicated by off flavor‚ "ropy" consistency‚ discoloration‚ etc. ,1130431149112
213.237.55.236,peter,29 Oct 2005,cheese@naeslund.dk, David / Cynthia: I have kept yoghurt in the fridge for 8 weeks with no problems. At yoghurts normal pH you shouldnt see any of the usual suspects w. regards to pathogenic bacteria or molds ( the typical molds we see on milk products wont grow properly at a pH this low ). I'd open the container‚ look at the product and expect some whey on the top‚ but apart from that‚ it should look and smell like yoghurt. If not I'd discard the whole thing. Some of the "bad" molds can release some toxins‚ and with yoghurt being a liquid product these toxins can spread easily,1130614127359
69.162.113.97,David F.,30 Oct 2005,fankhadb@uc.edu,Peter: Do you know of any specific strains of pathogenic molds which are known to grow a acid pH? My impression is that only non-pathogenic fungi grow at these low pHs. I have seen white mycelium (cottonly-like growth) on top of yogurt which is months old‚ but have not had a problem using it for cooking. Neither Aspergillus flavus‚ of aflatoxin fame‚ and Stachybotrys‚ the most famous house toxic mold‚ could grow on yogurt.,1130689345515
4.224.114.14,Courtney,30 Oct 2005,ghping@Aol.com,It's neat how you can make all these food products so easily! i really enjoyed making these products!,1130711621859
24.247.191.236,pam,01 Nov
